Winkleman Family Homestead

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00:00
This is Mary Lewis at A Tiny Homestead. The podcast comprised entirely of conversations with homesteaders, cottage food producers, and crafters. If you're enjoying this podcast, please like, subscribe, share it with a friend, or leave a comment. Thank you. Today I'm talking with Anna at the Winkleman Family Homestead. Good evening, Anna, how are you? Good evening, I'm good, how are you? I'm good, I don't usually do recordings in the evening, but I had to talk to you, so this was the only time that worked. I had, I get to talk to you.

00:29
Oh, thank you. Very honored. Yeah, I have a hard time at night because I tend to go to bed early. So I want to drink all the coffee in the world in the afternoon if I'm going to be up past like eight. And I was like, I can't drink coffee all afternoon because I'll be awake all night. So this is what we get people. We get a sleepy Mary talking to a very pretty Anna. It'll work out great.

00:56
All right, so Anna, tell me about the Winkleman family homestead. So I have a husband and three small children. My children range in ages of three months to four years. And I grew up in St. Louis city in Missouri, so not homestead at all. It was very urban. And honestly, like the little house in the prairie vibe, I always kind of liked.

01:25
but it just seemed like something that wasn't attainable. So yeah, I think my why started with COVID. When I saw those grocery store shelves empty, I was like, wow, maybe our systems aren't as, are more fragile than I think they are. Maybe I should do something about this and prepare myself more.

01:52
Yep. And that's, I think that's why the homesteading movement really picked up steam in 2021. I was going to say, you probably have had several interviews like this. Um, there's been a lot of talk of COVID babies and I don't mean human babies. I mean, new ideas, new projects, new focuses, COVID babies is what I call them. And the one thing that got me with the supply chain issues.

02:19
is I really like using Dawn dish soap, the green apple scented kind. Could not find it for a year. I was so mad because all the other dish soaps to me smell terrible. And I'm the one that does the most dishes. And I was like, I want my green apple Dawn dish soap back. Yes. But there were worse things than that. I mean, there were medications you couldn't get. There were just all kinds of things that you could not get.

02:50
And like we're through it. I think we're okay now for a while until the next thing hits. But yes. I had a formula fed baby during that time during the formula shortage. It was pretty rough. Yeah. Yeah. That's the other stuff that really scares me because I nursed all three of the babies that I birthed until they were...

03:15
I think my daughter was six months. I think my son was about six, seven months, and the last boy was eight months. And I can't imagine not being able to find formula for my babies if I wasn't nursing them. Just, it makes me choke up now just thinking about it. So yeah, that's terrible. So what did you do? How did you handle that? Well, we went to our pediatrician and...

03:42
We're like, well, what do we do? It's just not there. It's not on the shelves. And she's like, well, there's not really a substitute for formula. And I'm like, well, formula is a substitute. There has to be something. I know that our grandmothers made things. And she was basically like, you can't really do that. It's unsafe. Your baby will get sick. And so essentially what my husband and I did is we prayed before going to the store.

04:12
And just hoping that it would be there when we needed it and it was Every time that we went so I Just prayed Yeah, yep. And the fact is if it's a choice between your baby dying of starvation Right or trying something that might not be safe, but won't kill baby. I think that the thing that's not Not defined as safe might be better than it starving to death. So

04:40
Right. And the nice one of the good things that came out of COVID is that the European formulas are much more accessible in the US. So that has been great. And they're, they're healthier, they're better. If the US formulas, most of them, the first ingredient is corn syrup. But whenever you look at the ones from Europe, the first ingredient is milk, which is great. Yep.

05:09
Okay, so now I know your why. So what's the what? What's the how? What are you doing at your place? So we live, we're still pretty urban at the moment. We don't really have a whole lot in the way of land. We have like maybe a fifth of an acre. And we have a small house on top of that, 768 square feet. I know exactly how big it is because I have to use every inch of it. So.

05:38
Yeah, it just started with like preservation with just different skills sourdough baking Gardening I don't have chickens yet But that's on my list for it was on my list for last year And then I found out I was pregnant and I was like I don't think I can keep chickens and the baby and the garden alive, so Gonna have to pick something So chickens are next year and then probably the biggest thing that I've been doing though is

06:08
Just making, building relationships with those around me. A lot of farmers in the area. I know where to go to get raw milk now. I know where to go to get beef. And that's been such a blessing and I've met so many wonderful people through that. Yes, resources is a big part of homesteading for sure. We were in the same boat as you.

06:34
for 20 years. We lived in a house that was 850 square feet of living space. It had three bedrooms and it was my husband and I and our four kids on a tenth of an acre lot. So I have literally been in your shoes and you can do it. I mean, we grew a really nice garden on that tenth of an acre and it wasn't a very big garden, but it was productive.

07:02
And there was a huge patch of rhubarb that had been there for years. Like when my husband bought the house, like I think it was a 12 by 12 patch of rhubarb. And my neighbor said that the rhubarb was probably at least 50 years old, the roots because she's, she knows about plants. So we had, we had lovely rhubarb. We would share it with everybody because, because we're the only ones on our block that had rhubarb.

07:31
Mm-hmm. And so, and so I was like, anybody need rhubarb? Because I have it coming out of my ears right now. Come take some. And if you want some of the roots, take those too. And we grew peonies and we grew little roses bushes and we grew climbing roses on the trellis in the back. And it was just this lovely urban garden thing. And we gave the neighbors produce every summer. It was, it was just really fun.

08:02
And then we moved because we were tired of being in town. So now we're on a 3.1 acre lot. But you can do it and you can do things like, um, you can get raw beeswax from the hive that the bees have made honey in and you can melt that wax down like seven times in boiling water, let it cool down, all the wax rises to the top, all the yuck falls to the bottom.

08:31
and you have beautiful beeswax to make candles with or lip balms or soaps or whatever. There's so many fun things that you can try just because you can do, just because you can, that are homesteading skills. Absolutely, yeah. And that's something that I've been really encouraging a lot of my friends to do and just people around me that even those who live in apartments, you can have a few tomato plants on your patio, you can have a little herb garden.

09:01
and you can learn how to can. And actually when I started canning, I didn't have any equipment. My husband isn't really 100% on board. He's kind of supportive, but he's like, I'll call him frugal, but he's kind of cheap. So I was trying to find ways to make it really frugal. And I managed to do a bunch of canning without actual canning equipment.

09:30
I kept some canning rings on the bottom of a stock pot just so that the cans didn't or the jars didn't hit the bottom. Yeah. And just using things I had around and it worked.

09:44
Yeah, I wouldn't, I'm not recommending anybody do this. Do not do this without looking into it and learning about it. My husband's grandma used to make tomato sauce by just hot canning, not actually water bath canning or pressure canning, but just making sure the jars were sterilized and then putting the hot tomato sauce in the jar, wiping the lid with vinegar. The, the

10:13
rim with vinegar and putting the clean lid on. And my husband was like, I think we should try it. And I'm like, I think we're going to die. And he was like, we're not going to die. Nobody died in my family from eating her tomato sauce. And I'm like, okay, we can try it. I said, but if I see anything in that, that tomato sauce, when I open it, it's going to the trash. And he was like, okay. So he did that one time and it made me so nervous. I mean, we ate the tomato sauce, nobody died, but I don't ever want to do it again.

10:43
So the point of me telling the story is that I would not recommend that. There are things that our ancestors did that might not be as safe now as they were considered to be then. So, but, but yeah, I literally, every time I open one of those jars, I put like a little star on the lid. So I knew which ones were done that way. Every time I opened a jar, I'm like, don't let us die. If we eat this, please, I don't want to die of botulism. It seems like a terrible way to go.

11:14
So yeah, there are risks that I'm willing to take and some that I'm not, and that one was very, very iffy. Yes, I probably would also not take that risk. Yeah, yep, I was like, I don't know, babe, this seems like a really, really iffy kind of thing to do. And he was like, it's fine. And I'm like, okay, I'm gonna trust you, but if I die, I'm coming back to haunt you. And he's like, okay.

11:43
The Amish do it. They have practiced that for a really long time, but yeah, I'm not sure I would do it. I don't want to do it again. I really don't. Next time he's like, I'm going to do it that way. I'm going to be like, well, you're going to be eating them by yourself. I don't want to do it.

12:06
Speaking of the Amish, I was actually another... I have a couple other things. That's not exactly my why. Yeah, go ahead. Yes. No, go ahead. I was just going to say... Oh, sorry. So part of my why was for health... is currently for health reasons because I've done a lot of research on just how this way of life is just healthier. Being outside is healthy and canning your own stuff from your own garden organically is healthy.

12:34
And I started researching how the Amish have very, very low cancer rates and very, very just from, I don't want to get into a vaccine debate, but they don't vaccinate and they also grow their own food and preserve their own food and they just live really healthy lives. And I don't know, I just think there's something to that.

13:02
Yeah. And also, I don't think I could be wrong. There may be an Amish man who's in his 50s sitting on a rocker on a porch right now smoking a pipe. But I don't think the Amish smoke, I don't think they drink alcohol. You know, all the vices, I don't think they have as many vices as the average American does. It's all it's all a crap shoot. There's so many bad things that we do that all pile on that.

13:30
make us not as healthy as we could be. Right. And whatever you can do to mitigate some of that, do it. We eat tomatoes all the time because they have antioxidant properties in them. Antioxidants are very good for your body. It helps you. So anything you can do to improve your health, I am all for it.

13:54
So I was gonna say, while we're talking about the things you can do if you don't have room to grow your own stuff, is you can do a thing that we used to do. We were lucky enough to live near an apple orchard where the owner would sell his seconds, the apples that weren't very pretty. He would sell half a bushel for like 12 bucks, half a bushel of apples. And that's a lot of apples.

14:24
Oh, two months worth of apples for a family of six. Nice. Yep. So we would go up every fall and we would buy a bag and I, we would make apple sauce because real apple sauce from apples cooked down with just a little bit of sugar in it. So good. And we would make things like apple pies, but we wouldn't bake them. We would put them in the freezer and bake them in the wintertime.

14:51
So we had like an almost fresh apple pie in January. And we would do- That's so nice. I do something similar. We did like an apple butter. Yeah. All right, you do something similar. We do something similar. We go to a farmer's and get, so my first year gardening was a crap shoot. It was awful. I failed miserably.

15:20
I failed a few times since too, but it was pretty bad. So I actually went to a local farmer and just, he gave me, well, didn't give me, he sold at a pretty reasonable discount. I think it was like $20 for a huge box of tomatoes. So I canned our own salsa that way. I made some bread and butter pickles. He sold me a bunch of pickling cucumbers. Yeah, it was good. It's so, like it's work. It's work to do this.

15:50
But I'm telling you, there is nothing better than going into your closet or your cabinets or your pantry and grabbing a pint jar of applesauce that you cooked down and you put in the jars and you water bathed and you put away and opening that up and tasting it because it tastes exactly like the moment you cut into the apple that you're eating.

16:18
It tastes better, I'm convinced. Mm-hmm. Yeah, there's some real pride and satisfaction in all this stuff. And I, anyone who's never done it, I don't think they have any concept of it.

16:33
Yeah, I agree. And you can tell I'm like steadfast in this because every time I talk about this with somebody who gets it, my voice gets really ringy. I can feel it in my jaws and my head. But yeah, it's just, I don't know, I love it. And I'm at the point where there are certain things that I really, really love to do that are homesteading skills.

17:01
The stuff that's a homesteading skill that I don't really love to do, I'm at the point where I don't really do it anymore. I used to love to do cross-stitch things or gifts for people. I don't do it anymore, because it makes my hands hurt. And I don't crochet as often, because it makes my hands hurt, because I'm getting older and my joints hurt a little bit. So, when you're younger, so many things you can try. And things that you can try just for the hell of it,

17:31
just because I think I want to learn how to do that. I don't really have a purpose for it, but it looks fun.

17:38
I'm assuming you've tried that. Oh yeah. There's a few things, like making my own cleaning supplies, just different things that I've learned how to do just to say I could do it. I don't necessarily want to keep doing it, but I want to have the skill. Like cheese making and yogurt making, I've done both of those things. I just don't do them all the time. Yeah.

18:05
A skill that I tried doing just because I could is lock picking. My youngest son wanted to learn how to be a locksmith like five, six years ago, maybe more. And he ended up getting a locksmithing tools kit. And it has the little picks that you use. And he was all excited because he had an old padlock and he got it to unlock with the picks.

18:34
And he was like, watch mom. He showed me how to do it. And he locked it again. He said, you try it. I was like, I don't wanna pick a lock. He said, I just showed you, you try it. And I did it on the first try. He's like, you are no fun. He said, you have such beginner's luck. And I was like, well, you told me to do it. So I did it. So I sort of understand the mechanics of picking a lock. Not that I will ever do it for nefarious purposes, cause it's not who I am. But that was one of those things that I learned how to do just because somebody said, do it. And I tried it.

19:05
So that's what I meant. There are things that I've learned to do that I will never use. I will have no use for it ever in my life. Right. But anyway, so you said you're in Missouri, is that right? In Missouri, yep. Yeah. How's your garden done this year? Well, the weather, I just can't decide what it wants to do. And we had record rainfall in July.

19:35
It's been, I've gotten some cucumbers done pretty decently. Of course, every year my garden, it's kind of a battle between me and the squirrels. So I got a decent crop of tomatoes, I got cucumbers, some of it is just, it's just gone. Yeah, it's been a rough year for a lot of people across the entire US because Mother Nature can't decide what she's doing.

20:06
Our garden's a mess. Our garden's a disaster. It's, it's, I don't even want to talk about it. It's such a disaster. No, I think that, I don't think that's great. I'm sorry. I think it's, I think it's great to talk about because I feel like we have this fear of failure a lot of times. And whenever somebody wants to pick up a skill and they don't do well with it at first, they just want to throw up their hands. But yeah, it's, it's hard. And just

20:34
Yeah, my first year gardening, I didn't do any research and I planted a broccoli plant in the middle of June or something. And it was just a bad, it was, so the following year I actually read a little bit about that and learned I shouldn't do that. And I had a little better second year, but yeah, I think it's good that we share how things aren't going well.

21:04
encourages others. Yeah, let me just tell you a little bit about broccoli for a minute. Broccoli is a cold weather crop and even if you plant it at the right time, it's still probably not gonna work out great because they don't get big enough to pick until it's hot out. And then they bolt and they're no good. They flower out and they're gross.

21:25
So broccoli is a pain in the butt to grow and we did it for a couple of years and gave up. I don't, we don't grow broccoli anymore or cauliflower because it just is too hot in June. And we plant them as soon as we can get them in the ground in Minnesota, which is usually not till May 15th. So there's not enough cool, long-term cool, like there's not enough months of cool weather for it to do well. So I understand your pain on that one.

21:55
And the reason I said I want to talk about my garden is because the last three summers it's been beautiful, just lush produced tons. I mean, not tons, but but many, many pounds of produce for us and to sell at the farmer's market and to share with people. And I've had people messaging me and calling me and saying, you guys have tomatoes this year for canning. And I'm like, I'm so sorry. No, we do not have to.

22:22
And everybody's like, you seem so sad. And I'm like, I am. I expected to have panning tomatoes for us and everybody else this year, but nope. Nope, it's been awful. And my husband is the gardener and he's been, I've said this a couple of times, he's been so great. He has been so reasonable in his disappointment with his garden this year. I thought he was just gonna be grumpin'. And.

22:47
He's like, there's always next year. We've gotten some tomatoes to eat. We've been some cucumbers. It's all good. I'm like, okay. I'm waiting for him to blow up about it. I'll figure about the end of September when he puts the garden. This summer socked. I'm like, yep, sure did. Hun, you're not wrong. So it's been rough on everybody. And I'm, I'm very concerned about how much produce is going to cost in the grocery stores this winter, because it's been rough for the.

23:18
the bigger producers too. Mm-hmm. So I'm a little worried about that, considering I don't have anything to can from myself. I'm gonna be relying on the canned stuff from the store. Uh-oh. Right. So that supply chain thing might become an issue here in two or three months, I don't know. We'll see what happens. I don't know. I'm crossing my fingers. It's all gonna be okay. So anyway, you have little ones, yes?

23:47
I do. Okay. Two little girls, four and three months, and then a little boy who's three. You have a three month old? I do. Yes. Oh, cute. Cute. I love babies. I've said this a bunch of times. I love babies. I really do. I'm glad I'm not in a position to be having any more babies, but I love babies. They are so sweet and they're so much fun.

24:16
Mm-hmm. I always say I'm going to be done having kids and then I'm like, I miss the babies. Uh-huh. Yeah, it's an addiction. They're delicious. I love babies. Babies are wonderful. So are the older two into helping out with what you're doing? A little bit. The older one had her own little garden bed this year.

24:43
Did it do great, but we're learning about... Okay, what did she grow? About how she grew zucchini and pumpkins. That's what she chose. Okay, and will she actually eat them? She does pretty well actually with vegetables. So yeah, she will eat them. We've gotten a couple of zucchini and maybe one pumpkin.

25:11
The issue has been her, she likes to be in control. So when I'm trying to give her direction, she's like, mom, I got this. And then she like plants the seeds too close to each other. So we're learning. Uh-huh. Mom, I got this. And you're thinking, no, you don't got this, honey. Yep. Our kids were not really into the gardening when they were small. They loved going out and picking.

25:41
the green beans and the peas and just eating them out of the garden. And they loved picking the cucumbers and eating the cucumbers out of the garden. They just were not into the actual gardening part.

25:55
So, I don't know. Our kids were crazy. They were into theater and reading and school. I mean, I can't fault them for that. Those were all good things to be into. But gardening was not a thing. They didn't love it.

26:12
We were bad parents. We ruined them. No, you don't have to garden. It's only the way we eat, but no, you don't have to garden. It's fine. But they're all, they're all good now. And my daughter is actually, um, taking care of her mother-in-law's plants right now, cause they're staying at her mother-in-law's house and they have, they're in Florida, so they have citrus plants and they have a pomegranate tree. I guess a tree.

26:41
and they have avocado plants. So she's been doing some gardening. Wow. And then the stepson is also doing his own gardens this year because they now have a place to actually garden in. So he's been sending us photos of his gardens and they're doing great. So apparently they learned to garden and they just didn't want to be part of gardening when they were little. Right.

27:06
So, and I don't, it doesn't matter to me if they wanted to buy everything at the store, that's up to them. So did you say that your husband did garden or he wasn't really a gardener either? He wasn't in his home? Not really. It's interesting, husband actually, so we both grew up like, I don't know, in kind of in the city, really urban. But his first job was actually working for a farmer.

27:36
He sold the produce at a farmer's market and he would go out and work the farm. So he's done that kind of thing before, but whenever it came to me homesteading, he thought it was just me having another fad, another thing I wanted to be a part of. He thought it was a passing phase, but it stuck around for a good four years. Yeah, it's amazing how the passing phases build up to become a life.

28:06
because that's what happened with us.

28:11
So, have you gotten into any of the crafting stuff that goes along with homesteading, like crocheting or sewing or anything like that? I actually learned to crochet when I was a kid. My mom taught me, and I guess it is a homesteading skill. I didn't realize I had one, but I've had one all this time. Yeah, so I've crocheted. I'm not a very crafty person. I'd much rather be in the garden.

28:41
My husband's a carpenter. That helps a lot. He's able to build me things, because that's a skill that I also do not have. I've tried. He asks me not to. It ends poorly sometimes.

29:00
Yeah. Um, the reason I asked about sewing and crocheting and stuff is a lot of the home studying skills start out as little hobbies. You know, things that our grandparents or great grandparents did and we find out about it and we're like, I should try that. That sounds like fun. And it's a little hobby, but all those little hobbies and things that you learn just compound and add up to

29:26
the things that you end up doing as a part of your everyday life. Absolutely. Yeah. And I for a long time. So I learned to crochet when I was a kid. And then I just didn't pick it up for years and years. And I saw some yarn and a crochet hook when I was cleaning up. I was helping my parents clean out their house. And I was like, Mom, can I take this yarn? And and I got back to it. I was like, this is I don't realize how much I miss this.

29:55
Yeah, it's very zen. It's very relaxing. I haven't done it in a while. I've talked about it a few times in the last few months. I'm like, I need to find my yarn stash and my crochet hooks and do some of that this winter. I think that what I would tell people, if they were like, how do I get into homesteading? I would be like, you need to go to a Joanne's Fabric store or a Michael's store, walk in and look around and see what grabs you. Because if it's the fake flowers that grab you,

30:25
You should be doing flowers. If it's the textiles, the materials, you should be doing sewing. If it's the yarn, you should be doing crocheting or knitting. Because really, I think that's where the little pieces start. And I know it's where it started for me, because I was like, I love Joanne's fabrics. I love the yarn. And then I was like, I hate knitting, but I could probably try crocheting. And that's where that bug got me, was just walking down the aisles of Joanne's fabrics, where the yarn is.

30:56
So, I mean, you can go to a farm and watch farmers milk cows or muck stalls or, I don't know, castrate steers. But I don't think that's the same thing for people just starting out. I think that's a much bigger scope. Right. No, I think that's great advice. Yeah. Whatever you're drawn to at the craft store, go for it. Yeah. It's like the Marie Kondo thing about whatever doesn't bring you joy, get rid of it.

31:24
Whatever does bring you joy, bring it into your life. And I just, I love cooking. I love crocheting. I love eating the food that my husband brings me out of the garden when the garden actually survives. It's, it's all just a lifestyle. And I've said this, I have said, it's just a lifestyle. Homesteading is a lifestyle choice in every interview I've done this week. And I've done four now.

31:53
It's a choice. It's a lifestyle choice. It's not about land. It's not about animals. It's not about gardening. It's about what you want to do that makes you happy and what makes you self-sustainable and feeling like you're doing the things that are good for you. Absolutely. OK, good. I think I finally nailed it. I finally got it down pat. Yes.

32:16
All right. I can't think of anything to ask you. I told you this was going to be silly because I'm sleepy, but it's okay. I try to keep these to half an hour, so we're at 32 minutes and 17 seconds. Thank you, Anna, for your time. I appreciate it. Thank you. It was wonderful talking to you. All right. Have a great night. You too.