A Tiny Homestead

𝗖𝗛𝗘𝗟𝗦𝗘𝗔 𝗖𝗛𝗔𝗣𝗠𝗔𝗡 | homesteading + holistic wellness + growing

Today I'm talking with Chelsea Chapman.
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00:00Did you know that Muck Boots all started with a universal problem? Muck? And did you know that it's their 25th anniversary this year?  Neither did I. But I do know that when you buy boots that don't last, it's really frustrating to have to replace them every couple of months.  So check out Muck Boots. The link is in the show notes. The very first thing that got hung in my beautiful kitchen when we moved in here four and a half years ago was a calendars.com  Lang calendar.
00:26because I need something familiar in my new house. My mom loves them. We love them. Go check them out. The link is in the show notes. You're listening to A Tiny Homestead, the podcast comprised entirely of conversations with homesteaders, cottage food producers, and crafters and topics adjacent. I'm your host, Mary Lewis.  A Tiny Homestead podcast is sponsored by Homegrown Collective, a free to use farm to table platform, emphasizing local connections with ability to sell online, buy, sell, trade in local garden groups, and help us grow a new food system.
00:56You can find them at homegrowncollective.org. If you're enjoying this podcast, please like, subscribe, share it with a friend or leave a comment. Thank you. Today I'm talking with Chelsea at It's Chelsea Chapy in Saskatchewan, Canada. Yay. Good morning, Chelsea. How are you? Good morning. I'm doing really well. It's nice and sunny here. Finally.  Oh, well, it's not nice and sunny here in Minnesota. It's kind of gray and it snowed yesterday. We got about an inch of snow on the ground.
01:26Oh man, well you're doing better.  I guess you're not doing as good as us. Our snow's almost gone. Yeah, ours was. Friday was 80 degrees here and then it got cold and rained on Saturday, thunderstorm Saturday night and then snowed yesterday. I was like, Mother Nature, what are you doing?  That's funny. It always  catches me off guard when it's it's 80 degrees and it's literally like a warm day here for us right now is like minus four. So it sounds so different. Yeah. And it's celsius.
01:56Yeah, and it's really different for here too. We don't get 80 degree days in March. So it was very weird. I did not love it. All right. So tell me about yourself and what you do, So my husband and I, we raise cattle and we recently just bought our own  quarter section here. Was it six months ago? And so we've moved in into like a little sixties farmhouse that we're currently renovating and we
02:25Finally, can have our, you're okay. I just have my son here with me.  We're finally  getting our own chickens and doing all the homesteading and things that I've been dreaming about for so long.  And then I also do social media and that's just like such a fun, creative outlet for me. And it kind of started during COVID, I got laid off my job and  I love doing photography and writing and things like that. And so it was just a really cool outlet for me. And then it started to gain traction and
02:54Here I am  like five years later doing what I do now.  Nice, very nice.  And it's so funny for you to say you've wanted to do for so long because you're not very old. What are you in your late twenties if that?  I'm 25. But yeah, when my husband and got married, we were renting and we've been married almost three years. And so when I got married is when I really started to, my interest and passion in these things started to grow. And because we were renting, we weren't able to do that.
03:23And so I just spent the last three years really trying to  just learn and learn and learn so that when I am in the position that I am ready to go. So here I am now just waiting for the ground to defrost and everything like that. Yep, exactly.  I'm so excited that you're 25 years old because I usually talk to people in their 30s and up because it usually takes us that long to get to where we can homestead on any kind of land.
03:52So I love that you're 25, you're young, you're raising a family and you're getting into this and that's amazing. Cause you are the future Chelsea. Yeah, it's when I look around at the world and I just think, man, how are we raising our kids? And I just take it so much more seriously when I look at my son, especially be like, he is the future. And if we are not putting everything into our children, then our future is going to look weak.
04:20And I really try and show that on my page, the way that we're raising our children spiritually, but also how much more effort we're putting into looking at their health, you know? I do. I have four grown kids  and my daughter was the first and she's 35 now. And she was what changed my perspective on the world too.  having a child can't help but change your perspective. It's just how it happens.
04:51Oh yeah, I've had such a perspective change. He's going to be  one in a month. And so it's just been so fun seeing myself change and grow from the person that I was into the person that I am now, even in the short 11 months that he's been with us already. Yeah, exactly. It's amazing that it's almost an instantaneous  mindset change,  but then you have to learn all the things to go with that mindset change.
05:20Oh yes, yeah, it's been a  big learning curve for sure.  Okay, so you said you have cattle. Do you have beef cattle or dairy cattle or what? We raise beef cattle, black angus, so that's kind of our niche.  I grew up on a farm just raising commercial cattle and then my husband, him and his family raised purebred  black angus and then they also sell like breeding bulls as well and we kind of
05:48got our feet into the water of that now and we've sold a few of our own purebred bulls as well. Nice. Is it sad for you when you have to sell them off or is it okay? We don't really  create much of an attachment with the cattle because they're mostly out in the field. don't know, growing up on a farm, it's  such a feeling I can't describe of  knowing that we love our animals so much and we take such good care of them but also knowing
06:17that they feed so many people  and it's just a beautiful circle of life really. Yeah,  it really is and  I  am a really soft heart Chelsea, I'm not gonna lie.  When we put all our chickens down last fall because they were getting old and lazy,  our egg laying hens.  Oh yes.  I had a pang. I had that little thing in my heart of this is  terrible, I hate this.
06:43But every animal that you have on a homestead or a farm has a purpose. And when they've outlived that purpose, that's the end for them. Exactly. And I definitely, we have a dog and we have a few horses.  And I definitely do have a soft spot for them because they are my pets.  And I know when I get  my chickens here in two weeks, so we've been working hard to set up our chicken coop, I think I'm definitely going to have an attachment to my laying hens for sure.
07:12Yeah, speaking of that, are eggs really expensive in Canada because they're ungodly expensive in Minnesota at the grocery store? Yeah, I think to get like an 18 pack in the grocery store is around $7, which for us is like that's pretty expensive. But I actually have a friend who has eggs, so I've just been getting from her until I...
07:38I'm able to get my own and I think I pay her $6 for like an 18 pack. So it's worth it to me. Yeah, absolutely.  I'm not, I am not going to tell you you're wrong. Eggs  from somebody else's chickens or your own chickens that live in a coop, you know, and they get outside and they get to eat bugs and seeds and fresh air. Yeah. Way better than grocery store eggs. had to buy. You can really tell.
08:07Like I can tell the difference between farm raised or store bought eggs. The yolks are just so much more rich colored and they just are so much better tasting. Like they taste way better. hmm. Yep. I didn't think it was just an America thing. I figured it was a world thing, but I wanted to check and see what was going on in your neck of the woods too. Yep. Okay.  What else?  Do you grow a garden at all?  I do. So last year,
08:36Like I mentioned before, our renting situation, I was unable to have one at our house, but between my parents and my in-laws, I was able to grow a garden. And at my parents' house, I grew lots of things. I grew a ton of cucumbers, like  massive rows of corn and a lot of potatoes, which my  family and I, we kind of shared the responsibility between watering and weeding and things like that.
09:01I was able to make a ton of salsa, a ton of  spaghetti sauce, canned a bunch of carrots and pickles. I made about 30 jars of carrots and pickles. And then I was able to freeze a bunch of corn so that we can have corn throughout the wintertime and things like that. And I froze a bunch of beets, so  I really love trying to get in the garden and harvest a bunch and fill our freezers.
09:30our canning room with goods for the winter time. Isn't it fun?  It is fun. I love it. Okay. I had to, I'm not going to lie to you. had to look up Saskatchewan to remember where it is because  my geography stuff in school was not real in depth for any country except for America. Go figure.
09:53So I looked it up and I was like Saskatoon is coming to mind and I looked up Saskatoon and found service berries. Do you have service berries around US?  Are you meaning  like Saskatoon berries or the service berries? Yeah, we have Saskatoon berries. There's a few local places that I actually went and picked last year as well. That's another thing that I went and did and I was able to make Saskatoon jam and I made some Saskatoon juice and then I froze some so that we can have some Saskatoon pies as well.
10:22Yes, there is lots and just about 30 minutes north of where my husband and live, there's  up in the hills, there's wild Saskatoons too. Okay, when I read up on the Saskatoon berries or service berries as they're also called,  it said that they have like an almond flavor. Is that right?  I really want to describe them is that  it's almost like eating a blueberry, except they're not as tart.
10:51they're more sweet. Okay. And the wild Saskatoon berries are a lot smaller. They're almost like a, I can't remember if it's like a juniper berry or something like that. They're a lot smaller, but the tame Saskatoon berries, like if you were to go to a farm, they're a lot bigger. They look pretty much exactly like a blueberry, but they're a lot sweeter tasting. Some of them have a bit of a tartness, but they,  they remind me more of a blueberry. Okay. All right. Cool.
11:18Yeah, I was reading about it and I'm like, no one has ever told me that a Saskatoon berry has an almond flavor to it. you're wrong. I would never describe it. I would never describe them as that. Yeah, Google was wrong. Yep. First time ever. Hmm, weird. Yeah. Okay. So how long is your growing season there? Because ours is basically here in LaSore, Minnesota, where I live.
11:46It's May, we plant in the garden in May 15th and everything's pretty much done by first of October. So what's your growing season? So we can,  Saskatchewan, we can get some late frosts. And so usually I don't get things in the garden until like  May 27th at best, you know, or even the first week of June. And then typically depending on when the first frost  hit.
12:16It can go into that first week, second week of October as well. Okay. So, so we have maybe another week and a half compared to you. Yeah. Yeah. You're actually not too much different than us. Yep. And we're actually Southern Minnesota.  Um, I'm guessing if we lived in Northern Minnesota, our growing season would be shorter.  So how far south are you?  Um,  Iowa is maybe an hour and a half south of us.  Okay. Okay.
12:46So we're not far from the Iowa border. And  we're about four and a half hours from the South Dakota border.  And we're about an hour and a half from the Wisconsin border.  we're kind of, we're not central. We're like West central Minnesota. Yeah. Yeah. We actually live really close to the U S border as well. Like we are about an hour.
13:15straight south of us and you would  be going to Minot. Yep.  Okay, cool.  So I don't,  I'm really walking up to a line here.  I  don't talk politics on my podcast. I try really hard not to.  Yep. But  you're in Canada, I'm in America.
13:40How are things doing in Canada regarding the American government right now? Just be careful of what you say.  Yes, I will.  Well, as you  may or may not know, Canada is actually gearing up for an election in about 30 days, the shortest time for an election to be held ever due to our previous Prime Minister Justin Trudeau  not handling things well. So between that and then the tariff wars going on,
14:10Um, I don't know, it's been a little bit disappointing as a Canadian.  Um, just say, don't say this if I can't say this, but it's been a little bit disappointing as a Canadian just because  so many of us were rooting for Trump to get in. We've seen kind of what you guys have been going through with the Biden administration. And then  to see Trump get in and just turn his back so,  so quickly on a neighboring nation that, you know, we have been.
14:39friends since the beginning. And so it has been a little bit of feel like a stab in the back. And I know that maybe lots of the American people don't feel that way, but Trump does represent you guys. And so that's kind of how it's felt for us.  we're really hoping  and praying that  Pierre, the conservative leader that he can get in. And so in a month, we'll really be able to see it. Maybe we might be doing a little bit better, a little bit worse.
15:07Uh huh. I feel like we're all in a holding pattern right now. And I don't know about you, Chelsea, but I do not like holding patterns.  No. Oh no. Me neither. I hate that waiting area. You know, like I just, I struggle there. Yeah.  Yep. And the other thing that's been really hard here in America is the, a lot of the federal grants were stopped.
15:31And a lot of people in agriculture rely on those grants every year at this time.  So yeah, it's been, I'm going to be really careful because I don't want to say things that I'm not educated on, but it's been chaos here.  not like in my little part of the world here, my home, my land, everything's okay. But
15:58When I look at all the things that are affecting so many people in my country, it's really hard to not be, I don't know, sick at heart a little bit over it.  Oh, I feel you. it  kind of seems like just being so secluded out in the country, you're kind of secluded from it all. But it seems to be touching the small towns and just encroaching more and more to affecting our day-to-day life. Yeah. And  I don't know, it just seems like our
16:27current government, are so against like farming and the oil industry and things like that. And it just feels like every day you're waking up and you're trying to swim against the stream every single day. Yep. Is kind of how I describe it. Yeah. And, and I don't know what Canadian government is like, but here in the States, if you have a problem with the way things are going,
16:53our representatives and senators and all those people who are part of the bigger government, it's not just the president, the government part is who gets things done.  We can contact those people and say,  this is what I think about this particular thing that's going on, but you kind of have to tell them  what and why you think that way.  Not just the emotional part, but the actual how it's affecting you.  Yes, the actual reasoning.
17:23Yeah, in Canada, is that a thing that you guys can do? Yes.  Yeah, we do have representatives and then they take it to the next and then the next. And like, in each state, you guys have a governor, right? Yeah. Yeah. So here we have a premier. And so that's who we would, we would take our problems to him and then he would take them to more of a national level if need be. Okay, good. So you have a way to get your opinions and thoughts  to the powers that be, as I call them.
17:52That's correct. Good, because government in America is supposed to be for the people and by the people, and I'm assuming Canada is not that different. No,  it's really not that different. And I always like to say the government works for the people. We don't work for the government. And I feel like we have really lost touch with that saying, because that's way it should be. Yeah, it should be here in America, too. And I think
18:20I think that's all I really want to get into because I really, I don't want to make people angry. I want people to feel empowered. And that's why I said what I said about if you have a problem, these people are here to help you get that out there and dealt with. So anyway, that's the closest I've ever come to talking politics on the podcast with you, Chelsea.
18:46I'm literally sitting here buzzing like do I really want to talk about this? Have you ever had a Canadian on the podcast before? Yes, actually. There was a young woman. Her name was Becca Bia. She changed her last name to Hammond and she has many horses. I invited her to be on the show. Yeah, I don't know. I don't remember what province she's from.
19:15But she was great, she was adorable and she's so, so bubbly and is just mad about these mini horses. It was a really fun episode, it's already out. It's so funny. Yeah. That is so funny. So, and she just actually bought a mini horse from another person I follow on Facebook. And I didn't even know she was buying the mini horse from the first person that I follow on Facebook. I messaged her, I said, are you buying Katie's George? She was like, I am. I went, oh my God, it is such a small world.
19:44That's hilarious. Yeah. So, but we didn't get into politics, although she did mention that she wanted to get down to America to pick up George before April 2nd, before the tariffs hit. I don't think. right. Yeah. And something about she had to have a  broker because she was bringing another horse to America to drop off because she had an empty trailer. Why not?
20:12and she had to have the right paperwork to bring the mini horse back with her, George.  So yeah, there are definitely rules and regs to travel across the border right now and always have been, but there's just specific things when it comes to  livestock. Oh yeah, there's a lot of paperwork that goes into  transporting livestock to different countries.  Now, I am assuming that with your beef cattle, you are not...
20:40exporting that beef it's staying in Canada? Well,  we're not exporting it but I know that  once the beef is bought like by one of the bigger buyers then they often will export it.  Yeah. All right. Well, I'm going to throw this in in the middle of this because I've been trying to get it in on every episode for like the last three weeks. Whether you're in Canada or America,
21:07You really should know your local growers, your local producers,  and you should have a relationship with them because sometimes  things happen and supply chains go down. So get to know people like Chelsea and me who has eggs for sale right now at $5 a dozen.  just, you know, support your local people who are producing food because it's really good to eat local.  Amen.
21:34I could not have said that any better. really, people think they go into the grocery store and they think that  one stop shop, that's where their food comes from, but they do not see all the other hands and all the other processes that are involved. you know, if, if things go bad at some point on the world stage, getting food at the grocery stores is going to be everyone's last problem, except the people that are walking into the grocery store needing food for their family.
22:03And so even if you live in town, like there's so many things that you can grow. And there are so many people that live outside of town, like myself, that plan on growing a very massive garden that I want to feed other people. That is like a passion of mine is having a garden where you can come and pick for yourself  and,  buy it at an affordable price. Yeah,  absolutely.  Do you have people, you know, who are also doing this kind of thing, or is it, are you kind of in a
22:32a vacuum right now?  I know  quite a few people that like grow their own gardens but I don't know that I know any that really want to  get that food into other people's hands.  For myself it's just kind of a newer passion as I've just you know started to grow up and look at things and I love love love gardening and I really want to share that passion with others and share good wholesome organic food with others.
23:00Well, you would love my kitchen right now, Chelsea.  have baby basil  plants on my kitchen table.  think there's still some pepper seedlings. think there's still some tomato seedlings.  And out in our greenhouse right now, it is packed. My husband came in yesterday from  planting lettuce seeds  and he says,  we have a problem. And I said, oh, and he said, I'm running out of room in the greenhouse. I said, uh-oh.
23:28And he said, yeah, he said, it's going to be good when we can get the high tunnel plastic on the high tunnel greenhouse,  get the tables set up and start selling the bedding plants. So I have room to grow more things. And I was like, it's a never ending cycle, isn't it? He's like, yeah. No kidding. That is so funny. Yeah. I'm waiting for a nice warm day here so I can get out and start some of my tomatoes and basil and peppers and things like that, just to give them a head start.  Yep.
23:57Because it takes like six to eight weeks for the tomatoes to be ready to go in the ground. Plus, I'm guessing it's still too cold where you are to even get them in the ground. Oh yeah, it's really cold still. Yeah. So, but he sent me photos from the greenhouse and I'm  not kidding. It is packed. Like,  I can't, I don't even know how he's got a Tetris in there to have everything in there he's got right now. I'm so excited. I can't.
24:25I can't tell you how thrilled I am that we're going to be selling bedding plants for the first time this year. That is exciting.  Yeah, the last few years we've actually just sold produce. when we got the greenhouse up last May, said,  how do feel about growing extra seedlings? And he was like,  I feel fine about that. For what? And I said,  to sell to people who want to try growing their own backyard garden? And he went, oh, yes, absolutely.
24:56I love that. I love that your husband loves gardening too. That is so fun. He loves it. It is his therapy. He, it's so funny. He, um, his job is taking care of repairing printers and fax machines and things like that.  Oh, cool. So he's very much  a  tech at his job job. And so  he absolutely loves it when he gets home and it's staying lighter later now.
25:26So he gets home, he eats dinner and then he's like, I'm out to the greenhouse and here soon it'll be, I'm out to the garden. And  he just putters and plants and checks on things and just like gazes over his creation and just grins. And I'm like, God, you need this.  I love that. Yep. That's how I am. That is, I take my shoes off, I get out there and I just want to absorb everything, you know?  Yeah. You should have seen him last fall when he brought six peaches in.
25:56from the two peach trees he bought  the previous fall. He came in with six softball sized peaches from these trees he had just put in the year before. That's impressive. And he walked in and showed me and I was like, where did you get peaches? He said from our tree. Probably proud as a peacock, hey?  Oh my God, his face was just lit up like a light bulb. He was so excited.
26:23And I said, are they buggy? And he said, no, he said, look at these. And they were beautiful and they tasted amazing.  I bet. I don't know what variety they are. I wish I could remember because I wanted to write it down and the tag got thrown away before I could. But I bet you you could grow them in Canada because I think they're a Canadian variety.  Oh, are they? Yeah. Because I really, that's the other thing I want to.
26:47I want to plant an orchard so my husband and I, we've been, you know, looking at all the different kinds of trees that we want and  discussing like that. And there are some  cold hardy peach varieties that are available. So we're definitely going to have to add those to our orchard.  Yeah. Are you going to do apples too?
27:06Oh yeah, apples. I like to do plums, apples, cherries, grapes,  then peaches if I can find  a cold hardy variety for sure. Well, I I know the variety that we put in is cold hardy. So I will have to ask him if he remembers what it was and I can message it to you.  Oh, that would be amazing. Yeah.  Unbelievable peaches. I mean, I have had peaches shipped to me from Georgia and these were right up there with Georgia peaches. I'm not kidding.
27:38that oh man a few years ago my family and I we went to British Columbia and they are known for peaches  and oh my goodness their peaches were amazing I haven't had peaches like that since.  Yeah and it's so funny because you get you get fruit at the store you know the grocery store and it's fruit like  an apple tastes like an apple  but it's not the same as when you go to the orchard and pick an apple off the tree.
28:06rub it on your shirt and then bite into it. And I don't know  why, why it's so different. You would think that an apple is an apple is an apple, but it's not.  This is really interesting. Um, so all the fruit that we get in our grocery stores, like it has to be picked weeks before it's actually raped. they give it, I cannot remember what it's called, but it's a hormone  and
28:32You can Google it as soon as we're done. can't remember what it's called though. They give it a ripening hormone right before they're going to like put it into the grocery store. And that's probably why it's not the same is because they're picked so prematurely and then they're given a hormone to ripen quickly to look good, but it's actually not the same.  Yeah. And I mean, I knew, I knew there was a reason. I'm glad you mentioned that, but it's just, it's so funny to me that, that
29:02Yeah, grocery stores have a purpose.  know, not everyone can get 20 miles away to pick apples at the apple orchard.  it would be so much cooler if people understood that when they eat in season and maybe like gather a couple friends and somebody has a car and they can go pick  apples in season. And I would love to have somebody there take a  video of someone who's never eaten an apple right off the tree.
29:32biting into that apple. Wouldn't that be amazing?  Oh, it would be. You'd probably be shocked. This is what an apple tastes like. Yeah. And I choose apple because everybody knows what an apple is  in North America. And we all know that an apple tastes like an apple, but there are varying flavors and textures on apples. And there's this one apple that the University of Minnesota  developed.
30:01and it was called MN 1661 was the original name, because that's how they do it. They name it Minnesota and then a number. And it eventually became the Renaissance apple. And it's a really early apple. It ripens up like at the end of August. And I am in love with this apple. I did not get any this year because we weren't up to get them, but it tastes different than any apple I've ever had.
30:29It's nuts to me that  all these fruits have different flavors and different textures and different colors, you know? Yeah, it is amazing. So many different variations of the same fruit. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And  as humans, we love variety. We love a different color or a different feel or a different smell.
30:58I understand that apples  basically give you vitamin C. I think there might be a little vitamin A and it's good for you to eat an apple. But I don't think apples are about eating for nutrition. think apples are  for eating because they make you feel good, like  psychically, not biologically good. Yeah, that's interesting that you say that I can really...
31:27That describes a lot more how I feel eating an apple now, especially when you eat it like outside. Like there's just something about picking an apple from a tree and eating it. It just makes you feel connected. Yeah. You know, like, it's so that's so interesting. Yeah. And we're so, I mean, so many of us are so disconnected from where our food comes from, which is part of the reason I started the podcast, because I was like, there's a lot of people who don't know that milk comes from cows.
31:57Yeah,  think brown milk comes from brown cows. Yeah, no chocolate milk does not come from brown cows. Last I checked.  Yeah.  So  anyway, I'm mostly we're just yapping here because we're past 30 minutes, Chelsea. I try to keep us to 30 minutes. So  thank you so much for your time and please keep doing what you're doing and try to pull your friends in to do it too. Okay.  Oh, trust me. I will be trying my hardest.  Good.
32:27Keep doing the good work. Okay. Thank you so much for inviting me. Thank you. Have a good day. You too. Bye bye. If you like this podcast, you would probably love Amy Fagan's Grounded In Maine podcast.  You can find her on  all the platforms grounded in maine.com.
 

High Prairie Press - if you have wanted to write a book, this is for you

Today I'm talking with Annie at High Prairie Press. You can follow on Facebook as well.
A Tiny Homestead Podcast is sponsored by Homegrowncollective.org.
 
Muck Boots 
Calendars.Com
If you'd like to support me in growing this podcast, like, share, subscribe or leave a comment. Or just buy me a coffee 
https://buymeacoffee.com/lewismaryes
00:00Did you know that Muck Boots all started with a universal problem? Muck? And did you know that it's their 25th anniversary this year?  Neither did I. But I do know that when you buy boots that don't last, it's really frustrating to have to replace them every couple of months.  So check out Muck Boots. The link is in the show notes. The very first thing that got hung in my beautiful kitchen when we moved in here four and a half years ago was a Calendars.com  Lang calendar.
00:26because I needed something familiar in my new house. My mom loves them. We love them. Go check them out. The link is in the show notes. You're listening to A Tiny Homestead, the podcast comprised entirely of conversations with homesteaders, cottage food producers, and crafters and topics adjacent. I'm your host, Mary Lewis.  A Tiny Homestead podcast is sponsored by Homegrown Collective, a free to use farm to table platform, emphasizing local connections with ability to sell online, buy, sell, trade in local garden groups, and help us grow a new food system.
00:56You can find them at homegrowncollective.org. If you're enjoying this podcast, please like, subscribe, share it with a friend, or leave a comment. Thank you. Today I'm talking with Annie Toro Lopez again. I just put out the episode with Annie from a week or two ago,  sometime in the last six days. can't remember when.  And  Annie talked to me about her Seeds to Savor page and stuff on the last episode.
01:25And today she's going to walk us through her process  of how she publishes books at High Prairie Press. So welcome back, Annie. How are you? Wonderful. I am well. Thank you so much, Mary, for having me back.  I'm very excited about this conversation. I am too, because that got to me like this bug has been kicking me for a week since we talked about doing this episode.  You're in Colorado, right?
01:53That's correct. I'm in  Elizabeth, Colorado, and we are  at 6,300 feet. That's  High Prairie. We're on the Colorado High Prairie, and that was the name for my publishing company, High Prairie Press. Beautiful.  the weather nice in Colorado today? Oh my goodness, not today. Everything's covered in ice. How about you up there?  It's gray.
02:22It's gray, it's probably 45 degrees and  we actually had kind of nasty thunderstorms yesterday. I believe it. There were tornadoes all across the country. saw,  I'm originally from Nebraska. I was born in New Jersey, raised in Nebraska  and in  an agricultural land,  lots of tornadoes across Nebraska. saw a video of someone in their house and all of their windows all the way around them were breaking with hail. Yeah.
02:50So it was, yeah, it was a rough day yesterday. I'm glad you guys are all okay. Yep. We're fine here. No broken windows. No, no cars got ding. No, no dogs got clunked in the head with hail. We're good. Um, and we're making a very small talk here, but I was, I was also born in New Jersey. I was also born in New Jersey. Where? Fort Dix. Wow. I was born in Plainfield.
03:19Yeah, I think Fort Dix is in New Jersey. So yeah, we have that in common too. Really weird. Yes, Wonderful. Okay. So what I want to ask you first is you had said back in the other interview,
03:39that it's always been your dream to be a publisher, but you have also written a cookbook. So were you a publisher before you wrote the cookbook or were you an author before you were a publisher?  So  I had published three books.  I published before my most recent cookbook. So I published four different books. One is a writer's handbook.  That was the first book I wrote. It taught me a lot about the process of publishing
04:09Um,  it was something just, just did.  I taught my degree is in English and I taught literacy, reading and writing for about 15 years. So  professionally and more before that, but  I,  um,  wanted to capture what  I had taught  as a literacy instructor.  so I made,  I spent like, I don't know.
04:39days, just listing words, like words that would come like metaphor and simile and antagonist and protagonist and  plot and resolution and  just words.  so this book is the death,  the writer's handbook defines those words and it's, it's  people who have it, I think find it valuable. It hasn't sold to many people, but writers, especially for  fiction,  memoir,
05:08anything you would have learned in like English 101 is all there and just really concise. So that's that book. Then I did a project in Southern Colorado around green chili because it's an iconic native indigenous, my husband is indigenous and so green chili was just always a part of his life. And so this was a way to capture stories and recipes.
05:38So that was the second real book that I published. And then I also published a small journal that's like available on Amazon.
05:51Journal of Memories and Food Connections and Traditions. And I used it to write the Green Chili Cookbook. And it ended up being kind of its own little thing. And it's a nice little thing. It's nice on people like it. But it's, again, it was never commercial, for commercial, really. So the Green Chili Cookbook is called Wharf and I was happy hard. it was a...
06:18kind of a passion project and I did it with a grant through  the age friendly initiative, which is something that Colorado has put money into.  and then I, so about a year after I published that cookbook,  uh,  my life changed a lot and I lost my best friend and my sister like six days apart.  And then three weeks later when I was in first place in a
06:48Cookie competition, was diagnosed with celiac disease and that really just derailed my life  at that point. So I did publish  the Simply Gluten Free,  Real Ingredients for Everyday Life almost by accident.  Because at that point I was really ready to go off  on a more published,  to be a publisher. That's what I wanted to do. I had published three books and I was like, okay, I kind of know that.
07:16You know, I know, and I'm going to learn more and  attending conferences and  workshops and professional development things. And I learned a lot  and was ready to write that I was actually approached by a chef here in Denver who wanted me to publish his cookbook. And literally on the way to that meeting, my brother-in-law called and said, you need to come home now. Yeah. Because my sister was dying. So,  um,
07:45But I didn't lose that. And then I published my gluten-free cookbook because I really felt like it could benefit the Celiac community. And I just received a review on Amazon that just so nailed what I was trying to do, what I was trying to accomplish, and that it felt really good. Because I want to help people who live a gluten-free lifestyle, or their family does, or they cook for someone.
08:15to navigate that world because it's rough.  But I didn't lose that. And so what I realized, I think, just even a couple of months ago, a few months ago at a big, there's a huge publishing conference that takes place in March. And in talking to colleagues,  I felt like I was kind of having an identity crisis because  I really want to be a publisher, but I'm out there marketing a book. So you have just doing both the...
08:44Marketing is ongoing, so it's always going to be there and that's part of the world.  So,  yes, that's the long answer. Publishing  is  truly my passion. love  getting other people's voice out there  to support them and have them have that voice. Okay, cool.
09:11So the reason that I wanted Annie to come back and talk to me is because she had said that she was interested in publishing books by people who are homesteaders and who are doing the homesteading things. And most homesteaders don't know how to approach a publisher. They don't know how it works. And Annie was kind enough to come back and she's going to tell us kind of the ins and outs, nuts and bolts of her process on how this works. we're going to use
09:41We're going to use me as an example because I have an idea for a book and I probably will never do it. But I figure  I'm here. I might as well tell you the idea. Yeah. Yeah. So the idea for my book that I keep talking about and I keep saying, I'm going to write a cookbook too, but I just haven't gotten there. That's not the same as writing a book book. My book book idea  is basically a simple book about how to get started learning.
10:10to cook because I've had so many people tell me I don't cook or I don't know how to cook or I don't have time to learn how to cook. And  I didn't either. And then in my  20s,  I was like, I need to make food at home. I don't want to keep eating out. I'm to be as big as a house. This is ridiculous.  And so I learned how to make a few things that come from a box, you know, add water, add butter, whatever.
10:36And then I was like, there's gotta be a better way. And I learned how to cook, you know, things from actual ingredients. And it's not hard. It takes, it takes the, the want to do it. And it takes being able to follow directions and it takes having the right tools. So basically in my book would, would be about introducing the idea of you can do this and the right tools, like how to, how to kit out your kitchen simply to start with.
11:05You know, do you need plastic measuring cups that are a quarter, a third, a half, and a one cup? Or do you need like fancy measuring cups? That kind of stuff. So if I was gonna come to you and be like, Annie, I have this idea for a book. And I run the idea by you and you go, that's a great idea, let's talk. What's the next step? Well, awesome. That was perfect, Mary, because
11:35The first step is to pitch your idea and that's what you just did. So you gave me the perfect pitch, right? This is  my idea, this is what I wanna do, this is what I wanna look like  and  that's the first step. So you would pitch your idea. If you have a manuscript already, that's fine and you  can accompany your pitch with your manuscript. But not having a manuscript
12:03is fine and  sometimes preferred.  So don't be afraid that, oh, well, I don't have anything  to show.  Just pitch your idea, just like you just did. Then the next step  is going to be  to,  so  if we accept it, if we say, you know, this is, we like this, I would want to see a copy of your writing, so a sample of your writing.
12:32and a sample of photos  where, you know, we, I would like, we  focus on beautiful books.  make beautiful books. Then if we would talk about, so what's your vision for the book? Do you want it to be fully illustrated? Do you want to have little stories in there in between?
12:59Do you want some full page illustrations or do you would you like to keep it? You know, so we talk about that.  Then we would talk about your goals for publication. So are you looking  to to have a bestseller? Are you? Do you want something that's just regional like a,  know, something just for your area? How to grow?  Crops that  are for your area.
13:29Um,  we were talking the other day about peony farms in Alaska and, uh, you know, like regional, that kind of thing.  Or are you looking for like a family keepsake? You know, you don't necessarily want to even  market it. So we would talk about that and your goals because that would inform. And then a timeline for the project. We would talk about  what's realistic, where you are in the  process.
13:59Uh, what your writing style, what we would, you know, if how much work we need to do there. Um, sometimes none at all, sometimes a lot.  And  so, uh, that we can  obviously make a plan and then we would talk about your budget because there are different  ways to publish  and  publishing is expensive. Like there's just.
14:29around it  and we would talk about the different types of publishing available. So I kind of want to talk a little bit about that because I think there's a lot of confusion.
14:47about  the difference between  a vanity press, a hybrid press, a traditional press,  and  self-publishing. So those are all different things.  And then there's even just like coaching, right? That isn't necessarily gonna take you, they're not gonna publish you, but they'll get you to the door.
15:16Then so a vanity press, vanity presses get a lot of bad  press and there's part  of that is because they deserve it in a way. Some do,  not all. A vanity press could be as simple as going to your local
15:39you know,  Minute Man, I don't know what you might have in your region, we have Minute Man press and they just publish whatever. They don't have any  criticism. There's no, you know, it's just I'm going to bring here and I'm going to get it published.  I'm going to print it basically.  And you know, they serve a purpose. So vanity presses get a lot of,  sometimes they miss the problem with vanity presses is they can misrepresent.
16:13They are something to be cautious of if you're really looking to publish a book and you want, know, okay, we're going to put that they don't offer any support. They don't offer any marketing. They don't offer any editing. They don't offer. So  it's literally just whatever you have, you can get printed.  Um,
16:35hybrid press is more  where is hybrid between,  me explain a traditional press first because then we could talk about hybrid. A traditional press would be  like one of the big five or a big publishing company that they're going to do  all of the work. They're going to own the rights to the book. They're going to do everything in house.
17:03you have less control, you have input for sure, but less control over things like cover design or  paperweight or whatever.  A lot of people get confused with traditional press because they get excited because you get an advance, right? So for one, those are going away. Like you just don't see that much anymore, other than the big five, obviously the big huge houses.
17:33But the royalty split generally with a traditional press is going to be 10 % to the author and 90 % to the house.  They do all the work.  get, you know, on the back end, they get  a bigger royalty split.
18:01hybrid press. Usually there's a  more  equitable royalty split is one of the things.
18:15but they're not also not they're not going to do all of that all of the
18:27upfront work and you're not going to get anything like a
18:36advanced because it comes out of that royalty later. it's  writing a book is always an investment, right? Like you're always investing in the future.
18:48With  an advance, what some people don't realize is that it's kind of like a loan. If your book  doesn't sell enough to cover the advance, you are responsible to pay back to that house. And most people don't realize that.  So that's  kind of the, you know,
19:13different, so those are sort of different paths to publishing  or the, then they're self publishing. So you do all, you know, you do the legwork, you do that. So it's always kind of up to the author how you want to approach it. But there's a lot of confusion, I think, out there about what those different entities  are. Yeah. far as paths to publishing. So what would you call your publishing house?  Hybrid.
19:42Yeah, hybrid press. Yeah, yeah. And so, so yeah, so then what we would, what we offer  and,  is,  once we, we agree that on, you know,  we want to work together and we can fit your budget and all of the things,  um, then we'll, we're going, we'd create a general, if you have a, so for, for your cookbook, we would create like a general outline for,
20:12you know, what topics do you want to cover? Like you were talking about the different, you know, like kitchen equipment, right? Like basic kitchen equipment, do you really need? So that would be one of our, that would be one section.  And so we would really, you know, create a skeleton of whatever you want to cover.  And then the next step would be, you know, let's put, put meat on the bones. So we would meet about,
20:41once a week  and  or if that doesn't fit in your budget we could meet every other week so we can work on whatever whatever works for you as the author.  About halfway through a book it is time to start applying for awards,  submitting for reviews,
21:11We would hire our cover designer  and  shout out to Tammy and Wood who's an amazing cover designer.  And work on  those sorts of things like starting to create buzz, get the word out there, do this, like podcast interviews, right?  And all of that, you want to do that early.  When you're about halfway through.
21:41A lot of awards have publication  deadlines, so you want to get that in. And  they open and close, so you want to get that in  pretty early. we're always,  of course, striving for excellence here, absolutely.  Then we would be working on things like  the
22:09basic metadata for the book, which are things like your ISBN number and those we get through Boker. Boker is the only official distributor of ISBN in the United States. Their website is my identifiers.com. are a lot, there are a lot of
22:41Predatory websites. don't know if predatory is the right word. That's probably not the right word. Third party. Let's just say that's a better word. There are a lot of third party websites that are that are.
22:58It's confusing because Boker is the name of  the company or the entity and their website is My Identifier. So there are like My Boker and you'll see things, but they're not official. Okay. So if you are self-publishing, if you do want to self-publish, you have to get your own  ISBN number.
23:25Amazon will give you an ISBN and so will Barnes & Noble.
23:31They, if your ISBN is through Amazon or Barnes and Noble, that is the only distributor. You cannot have global distribution. I highly recommend you buy and own your own ISBN.  Yep. Yeah. I learned about this back many years ago when I was doing, a friend wanted to write a book and she didn't know how to do it. She wanted to self-publish and I was like,  I can help you.
24:01I can learn this really quick and we can get it done. But do you want  an actual ISBN  number for your book?"  And she was like, I don't know. So we had to learn all that too.  And what I discovered is you can actually buy like 50 ISBN numbers or a hundred at a shot and it actually makes them less expensive. And I was like, I'm not going to be in this long enough to do that. So.  Yeah. Yeah.
24:30Yeah, I understand.  And you do want though.
24:36It's depending on how so each  each version of your book requires its own.  Is being  or is been, which is in the industry, what we call it.  If your ebook. Your paperback, your hardback, an audio book,  all those require so it is good to buy like five at a time. If that, especially if that I think they offer.
25:06And they don't expire. Right. So if you do want to, if you think you want to write another book, you know, that's like five Isbans a shot. I want to say, and I could be wrong here, but I want to say that the price break starts at 10. So like 10, 25, 50, a hundred. So buying 10, if you want to write more than one book, buying 10 isn't an under the question.
25:36And you do save a lot of money. And how much are they going for these days? Ma'am? Oh, was afraid you were going to ask that. I want to say $120, but I could be wrong. can look it up here. Per number? Mm-hmm. Well, but unless you bundle them and then they really are cheaper. And then you don't have to pay. Don't pay for your barcodes. I'm just going to look it up. Huh?
26:07Barcodes  are not are free you you can get a free barcode  when I bought a bundle from
26:20my identifiers at that time, they gave like five free barcodes. So that's fine if they want to. Let's see.
26:35So yeah, that's.
26:39I'm just looking here. I want to tell you, so  I'll try to get that for you. Okay. And we can even put, yeah, put it up later or whatever.  the other,  you're also, so at that point, we're also going to apply for your Library of Congress identifier.  You want to be in the Library of Congress, right?  And we'll also start.
27:08the  copyright process at that point.  when you're, again, so we're talking about halfway to,  you know, three quarters of the way through the book.
27:21was starting to do all of that paperwork and all of that legwork. You want it?  Go ahead.  All right. So we're getting into a lot of the nitty gritty and I wanted to do that. I think that anyone who's not really committed to the idea of writing a book at this point has just enough to know that it's going to be a process and that you need to have  your ducks in order to get it started.
27:51So I would love to spend the next 10 or so minutes if you have that to spend with me.  Talking about what kind of books you're looking for that you would like to publish from people.  Oh, absolutely.
28:07I would like to see manuscripts and ideas  around  homesteading in general.
28:19specifically all  food production  so  Can't  and food preservation cookbooks  seed preservation  Maybe you make pressed oils  People do like lati. I in our neighborhood. There's someone who has a lavender farm and she makes pressed oils  So  anything that  really has to do with
28:49food security,  your ideas.  I also am open to memoir. Memoirs are very, very different process. Memoir is its own  special genre.  But a lot of people like to write,  want to write a memoir. think a lot of it's one of the fastest growing  genres.  So I'm definitely open to that.
29:16Just so you know, if you do want to write a memoir,  like again, it has its own, it's its very own genre. There are very, very much rules  that you need to follow.  It  should read like fiction.  So if you have,  if you have a farm or a backyard farm or you...
29:41you know, grow certain vegetables. I mean, that's really,  really where  I would love to see submissions from  your homesteaders and the tattoos and beautiful, like illustrated.  We can work, if you're not a photographer,  there are,  we can work with what you have.  you know, and today's cameras really are high definition photos. So,
30:11You don't have to like have any kind of fancy equipment or anything like that. And Canva is amazing.  It's amazing. And we can  actually.
30:24One of the issues with photographs has been  for me anyway, for years, is always, you you can't scale up.  You can, yeah, you can scale down, but you can never scale up. Well, that's not true anymore, because, partly because of AI.  But you can, and you can also  convert files into like PNGs or whatever that translate better when we print. So it's,
30:53Don't worry if you're like, oh, I don't know if I have photos. It does help if you're a picture taker though. It does help if you like to take pictures of your process. That will help. Yeah. And it doesn't matter whether you have an iPhone or an Android because my husband has like the three generations back from new Samsung something.
31:19And  he took the most beautiful sunrise picture a week ago.  I swear to you, Annie, it looks like a painting. is so  gorgeous. it doesn't matter what kind of cell phone you have, whether it's Android or iPhone, you can do pretty much anything. Yeah, absolutely. And nowadays cameras, I just got a new Samsung because I  had a five year old phone and I think I dropped it to one too many times. So
31:47I had to get a new phone, which is just a whole like switch over, right? But anyways, but the camera is amazing. It's amazing. Yeah, absolutely.  Absolutely. Yeah.  And if you,  we would work, you know, for in design together. So with all your photos  that you want.  Very nice.
32:13The other thing that I want to throw in here really quick is that lots of people think that they're not writers. And  this may be true. There are a lot of people out there who cannot string words together and make it a good sentence. I understand that they weren't born with the talent to do it and  they haven't taken a class to learn how to do it. That's fine. Not everyone has to be a writer. Not everyone has to be a singer. I'm all good with that.  But  what is really nice these days  is
32:40There are all kinds of transcription services available online and you can literally tell your story out loud. The transcription  software  will put it into words for you and then you can edit it from there. So you don't even have to sit at the  keyboard for hours typing. can just talk into your phone, record your ideas.
33:08get it transcribed and then sit down and edit it from there. And  I learned this because of my podcast, because  the platform I use has a transcription function so that I can have the transcriptions in the show notes.  And I was like,  oh my God, I could be doing dishes, have my earbuds in, get ideas down, recorded, know, audially, and then have them transcribed and literally be able to sit down for four hours and edit them.
33:37I was so excited to discover this. So  even if you're not technically a sit down and type the words person, if you're a storyteller, you can jump on that and go from there. Yeah, absolutely.  Absolutely. That's a great point.  Isn't that amazing? Oh, I'm so glad because  I'm getting older  and I'm starting to get a little bit of arthritis in my joints and my fingers.
34:06So sitting and typing for hours is really not comfy, you know? That's excellent point. Yeah, that's a great point. Yeah, absolutely. I guess I'm thinking of the work that I did too, like, you know, through  our age-friendly initiative in a senior center, right? Like that was some, you know, I heard that as a concern. I don't, can't, you know, it's hard to write now. Yeah. Yeah,  yeah. And I'm so out of practice writing actual.
34:33actual longhand like with a pen or a pencil on paper because I never do it.  Who in the world actually writes on paper these days with a manual word processor?  do.  do.  I keep my notebooks. I have notebooks everywhere and I keep my notebooks. I was so proud of myself last year. had my notebook. I had my notebook from my business and I started it in January, I edited it in December and I had one page left.  Wow. I was very proud.
35:01Yeah, I write in notebooks. I write longhand a lot. helps  my brain to process what I'm writing. So  it's just something I prefer. I transcribe a lot from longhand, but I do write longhand, especially plans and that kind of thing. So yeah,  I do.  My husband brought me a box of pencils yesterday.  And can I just say it was like the sweetest thing ever.
35:30Uh-huh. He brought me my favorite Thai Khandro-Roga pencils. I was very touched.  That is really sweet. And I get it.  Back  when I wasn't so computer driven, I used to love a store called St. Paul Book and Stationery in Minnesota. And they had  every freaking thing under the sun for writing. And it had this, this smell.
36:00of paper and ink and  I don't know what it was but every time I went there I'd be here. Yes, Dixon Paper Company here in Denver. was the equivalent I think of what you're talking about. I know I was, oh I'd forgotten about Dixon until just now.  yes, that smell.  I understand your excitement about getting your favorite pencils because
36:25Um, years ago, um, one of the locations that my husband worked at, they were closing out one of their buildings and  he, he came across, he was helping clean it up and get stuff out and he came across a,  box and he opened the box, which is a really pretty little blue box and it had a gorgeous fountain pen  and,  a container of ink that went with it. And it was supposed to be like a gift to someone that just never got given out.
36:53And he asked the person in charge  if he could have it. And the guy was like, yeah, all this is going to the trash. Whatever you think is saveable and you have used for, have at it. He brought this home to me. I used that pen for five years. That's awesome. I love that pen. awesome.  Oh, that's, yeah, they're beautiful to write with, aren't they? Yeah. My favorite pen is the Uniball Vision. Just saying. Yes. Yes, yes, yes.
37:22I wish I knew what I need to do is I need to start keeping a journal a small journal again and actually writing it longhand because my handwriting used to be beautiful and I used to really enjoy the act of writing, you know, actual physical act. And then I got busy with other stuff and I just don't write anything on paper anymore. So I need I'm going to make a resolution right now. I'm going to find a book I'm going to start just writing the weather every day like
37:49like three or four sentences about the weather every morning.  that's a great start. I love the weather. I can be very weather obsessed. used to be a storm chaser in one of my previous lifetimes. It was a lot of fun, but I have to tell you that I posted a picture on Facebook in fact in January because  I bought two notebooks and  a package of pencils and for my business  notebooks for the year. And one was purple and the other one has  purple and pink unicorns and, and
38:19and my pencils were sparkles and I said, yes, they match and yes, they sparkle.  Yes, it helps when your tools make you happy. Right,  yes.  And it's sitting right here.  that's very, very, very nice.  We could geek out for days,  Definitely. I enjoy you, Mary. This was  so much fun. I really thank you so much for this because it really
38:48gives me an opportunity  to describe to your listeners  what we offer and  I really appreciate it.  I really appreciate you taking the time to talk to me about this because  most people do not know the steps. There's so much.  Yeah. It's a deep topic. It's a wide topic. It has a lot of moving parts, a lot of cogs, a lot of wheels. It's a huge topic.
39:17And we just  basically touched on the top of the ice or the tip of the iceberg today. Yeah. So  for the listeners, if anyone has a book idea percolating and they want to talk to  Annie,  how to contact her, be in the show notes, but it's, it's it's high prairie press.org, right? Correct. And my email is editor  at high prairie press.org. So feel free to reach out.
39:44Yes, because Annie needs books. She needs book ideas so she can publish them.  Yes.  All right. Awesome.  Thank you. All  right. Have a great afternoon. Thanks. You too. Bye. If you like this podcast, you would probably love Amy Fagan's Grounded in Maine podcast.  You can find her on  all the platforms, groundedinmaine.com.
 

Shell Smart - Australian Homesteader

Today I'm talking with Shell. If you've ever wondered what it's like to homestead in Australia, this will give you a small taste.
A Tiny Homestead Podcast is sponsored by Homegrowncollective.org.
If you'd like to support me in growing this podcast, like, share, subscribe or leave a comment. Or just buy me a coffee 
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00:00You're listening to A Tiny Homestead, the podcast comprised entirely of conversations with homesteaders, cottage food producers, and crafters, and topics adjacent. I'm your host, Mary Lewis.  A Tiny Homestead podcast is sponsored by Homegrown Collective, a free-to-use farm-to-table platform emphasizing local connections with ability to sell online, buy, sell, trade in local garden groups, and help us grow a new food system.  You can find them at homegrowncollective.org. If you're enjoying this podcast, please like, subscribe.
00:29share it with a friend or leave a comment. Thank you. Today I'm talking with Shell Smart and she is  in Australia and it's actually morning in Australia right now, whereas it's six o'clock in the evening here in Minnesota.  Good morning, Shell. How are you? Good morning, Mary  Ann. Good evening to you.  Thank you.  And the other thing's different is you are in the middle of autumn and we are in the middle of a spring, right? That's correct. Yes.
00:58Okay, so based on all of that, your growing situation is very different from ours, so I wanna touch on that. But first, tell me about yourself and what you do. Well, I am a wife to Stuart. We've been married for nearly 33 years. And we have five children and they range from 28 down to 15. We're homeschooling.
01:27still got two homeschooling or sort of one and a half homeschooling at the moment. So we're nearly finished with being homeschooling. think this is our  22nd year of homeschooling.  And we're homestead as well. So we have three acres right within the town limits, but a very small town of a thousand people here in  the snowy valleys of New South Wales  and in Australia. And yeah, we have three acres and we have a little homestead here.
01:58Very nice and  congratulations on making your marriage work for that long with five children to boot  That's that's  I'm one grandchild. Okay  Yeah,  well you have outdone yourselves. I'm impressed. I I've been married three times. I'm keeping the third one. He's great
02:27And  I can't imagine  being with someone for that long with that many kids because kids are a huge stressor on relationships sometimes. Yeah, they can be. But I think they can also really make you work better as a team because you've got something bigger than yourself to work for as well within your marriage.  True enough. Yes, absolutely. But you also have to be willing to do that.
02:55You both have to be willing to work together.  And  my first two,  I don't want to say anything bad, but the third one is more than willing to work with me to make this work. Let's put it that way.  That's the big difference.  It sure does. Okay. So  what do you do on your homestead? Do have animals? Do you grow gardens? What do you do? Yeah, we generally do grow gardens. At the moment, we haven't got any luck.
03:24this season because we're just finishing our harvest season.  So we haven't done gardens this last year, this last summer,  because we are moving and we just didn't have the time and energy to into that.  But  we do normally grow gardens with, you know, not a huge vegetable garden,  but we do have, you know, herbs and veggies and tomatoes.
03:53Well, I'm not very good at tomatoes. I like to plant lots of tomatoes.  And I get a few every season that actually grow. So that's something I need to work on. And one day I'll work on that when I've got more time and energy.  But we do grow a lot and have grown at the, again, at the moment we've downsized, but we have been in the past growing.  Between growing  and we have friends that hunt, we've been able to raise most of our meat.
04:22that we eat as a family. So  that's been good. So we currently have  our chooks, oh sorry, in Australia we call chickens chooks. So if I revert to that I apologize.  So chickens are laying chickens at the moment, laying hens.  And we have goats.  They have in the past been milked, but at the moment we don't have any babies and they're not milking.
04:49And we have had  meat chickens as well  and we just sent back some milking cows that we had on our property  that our friend  had lent to us over the summer.  A,  it  benefited her because she needed to reduce her load on her pasture and B, we needed to get some big animals on our pasture.
05:17We were able to be blessed by having two milking cows and two calves on our  pasture over the last four months, I think five months maybe.  So we're very quiet at the moment. Our poor livestock guardian dog, Chief, he doesn't have a lot to do. I we're down to about 15 hens and three roosters and a  small clutch of chicks  and two goats. That's all he's got to look after other than us in the household.
05:46He does a great job of that and we have, yeah, captain, inside captain, outside captain, inside dog and, yeah, children.  So it's  a menagerie whether that we're working farm or not at the moment.  Do you have  kittens right now? No, we have chicks. So we have cats.  We just have an inside cat at the moment and we have a barn cat.
06:14as well that lives outside although he's currently inside comes in for a morning cuddle  on the call of mornings.  But we also have my daughter who's between homes at the moment so she's renting a room at a friend's house and she couldn't take her cat with her so he is also at our place at the moment. So  yeah right now inside I have three cats at this very moment inside and I'm not an inside cat person normally but anyway.
06:44I  used to be and then  we got a dog  and I have decided that the dog is actually better than the inside cat so we don't intend to have any inside cats anymore.  We have two barn cats that we love to pet outside. They're great outside.  We have always had a cat that's generally been like you know
07:11inside when they want to be but outside most of the time.  currently she's getting old.  We worked it out the other day. She's just turned 10 and she's just not really all that interested in going outside on a nice day that's not too hot or not too cold or not too wet. In the middle of the day when she feels like she's up to it she might go outside for a little bit. She's an old lady. She has to take it in her time.
07:41Exactly, exactly. She has a nickname on here as Cranky Cat because she gets very cranky that one. Okay. So what kind of dog is your livestock guardian dog? He's a Maremma. Okay, I don't know what that is. Oh, it's the big white, pure white, furry dog. Looks like a sheep when they're laying in the body with a sheep. Like a Great Pyrenees sort of?
08:08Yeah, very similar but the Great Pyrenees are a more of a gold color and then they can also have brown in them. a Maremma.  So  the Great Pyrenees, I think they were bred in the French Alps and the Maremmas were bred in the Italian Alps to chase the bears and things off. So very, very similar dogs. All right, big dog, big boy. Yeah, big boy. He's a big boy.
08:36Yeah, my dog is a little girl. She's 36 pounds. Oh, wow. Yeah, she's not. She's maybe a fifth of your dog. Yes, yes, probably. We also have a New Zealand Hunaway. So she's officially a sheepdog in her breed, named Lola. But she was a rescue dog.
09:04and she's never been trained to the sheep. You can see the instincts there. She likes to chase the goats around and try and do something with them.  And the chickens, she's not very well trained from that perspective, but she's my precious. She's my inside dog. The kids tell me that she's the favorite child.  Yeah, Maggie's my favorite child too. I have four adult children and  they all think that Maggie is the special spoiled baby dog.
09:34I love that you call the chickens chooks. I'm going to start calling my chickens chooks.  You're welcome. I love it. It's better than chicken. Chicken, such a dumb word, chook is so much fancier, I think.  Oh, there you go. We always think it's more  redneck. We call it bogun. So, yeah.
09:56it would be wickedness to see this, right? I think actually in England, I think some of those people, some of the people in England call it chooks too, because I was chatting to an English lady a little while ago and I said something online and I said something about chooks. Oh, I'm sorry, chicken. And she said, oh no, no, no, we call them chooks too here. I was like, oh, great. I'm going to tell my husband and my son to start calling the chickens chooks because it's so much more fun to say than chicken.
10:23Chicken sounds so very in your nose and American and plain but chook sounds much better. Yeah. Okay.  So let me think. What else? Oh, I know what I wanted to ask you. What kind of predators do you deal with where you are? Any? Yeah, yeah. We have foxes.  That's the main one. So we are, I think I said that earlier, in the town limits of our town, village.
10:51So we don't have any major wild dogs or anything like that, but we do have foxes. Foxes will come straight into the middle of our cities. Here in Australia, they're quite a big predator. So they're our main predator. So Chief, we had some pretty devastating wildfires, we call them bushfires, here at the end of 2019, beginning of 2020.
11:20and we lost all of our bush in the mountains just nearby and the foxes moved down into the valleys which was we have a valley right next door to our property and all day and all night you could hear them calling and screaming and we would lose 10-15  in one day or one night or they'd be gone  and we just couldn't do anything to keep them. You'd be standing there and foxes would just come in and
11:51take stuff, take children's chickens. And it was so frustrating and we tried everything and over the year of 2020, amongst all the other things that were happening, I lost count and I stopped counting at 100 chickens that we'd And I gave up and I said, that's it, I'm not having any more chickens, no more, I can't do this anymore. And then, know, early 21, I was like,
12:19can't live without my chooks, I need more chooks. So we started researching it and we decided to get a meremma as a protector for the chickens. He's not great with the chickens in the sense of, know, I mean, him purely being here has reduced our losses significantly even before 2020. But he's...
12:49He is very beautiful, but he's a little bit dumb.  He's a little bit dopey. And he plays, he has no idea how big he is. And he wants to play with the chicks when they are, you know, that scrawny teenage age,  like around about 10 to 16 weeks.  He likes to play with them. And he's got this massive paw and he puts that,  he'll play with them and he'll put his paw on the mentions.
13:19We've lost very few to predators since we've had sheep, but we have lost a few to him. Whoops. Yeah, but that's pretty common. I have another friend that has a Marama and she was suddenly, her chooks were off the line and she couldn't work out why they seemed to be doing everything. And finally one day she went out to check for the chicken coop and there's her Marama puppy with his head in the nesting box eating all the eggs. And she went, ah, blocked.
13:48Oh those damn dogs, geez. They're so cute, right?  foxes are our main predators here,  certainly in this area.  Okay, well  we have something like that here in America with coyotes. Coyotes have been
14:15coming into the big cities because that's where the food source is.  Yeah. Yeah. the trash, all the garbage.  I live in the country. So we have coyotes that we hear howling at night, but they don't come on our property because of my dog.  She's outside all the time. They know there's another dog here. So they don't want to come anywhere near our property, which is really good. That's right. Yeah.
14:43That's good. you can hear them.  Yeah. In the springtime when they have their puppies, you can hear the puppies talking to the parents. Like they do these little yip barks. And it's the same as any puppy. They're just babies. And the first time I heard them yip, I was like, oh my God, there's puppies out there. And my husband looked at me like I was dumb and said,
15:08Those are coyote puppies. They are not friendly. I was like, no, but they sound cute. He's like, they sound adorable. We're not getting one. I said, yeah, no, I don't want them.  I don't need a baby coyote. have my own baby coyote. Her name is Maggie and she's an Australian shepherd and she doesn't, she's not going to hurt me. So.  Oh,  they're beautiful Australian shepherds.
15:31I'm in love with her. I've talked so much on the podcast about her. It's ridiculous. So I'm going to stop right now. But yes, I love her and she is very beautiful. Oh, that's so beautiful. Um, we foxes, I don't, you have any foxes or any foxes where you are? We do. We have the red foxes. Yep. don't know that was what you guys have. Yeah. Yep. There's a reason they say a sly as a fox or a cunning as a fox.
16:01We have friends, had friends years ago who had dogs chained up next to their chook sheds to keep the foxes away.  And this darn fox worked out. was one about a foot between where the chain ended and the fence line.  And this fox would actually walk like stroll, they got it on a video, stroll past this dog.
16:31because he knew, this fox knew that there was a foot that he couldn't get him in and he just walked through there and took chickens and went past him again.  Oh my gosh. When they said, and we're like, no way. And they said, yeah, look, watch this. They've got it on trail cam. And we're like, far out. Oh my goodness. Do you guys have coyotes in Australia or is that not a thing? No, no, we don't have.
17:00any large predators,  anything bigger than a fox really that's native. We have wild dogs that have, well we have dingoes  which are bigger than a fox. They're probably a small coyote kind of size on the smaller side  but they're almost extinct now. There's very few of them.
17:29and what they've ended up breeding because they are a dog. They've interbred with just dogs that have gotten out and  gone wild.  So we have very, very few pure dingoes in the wild anymore.  But they  are  much more wary of people so they wouldn't come into towns or cities or anything like that anyway. we do have some that one of the last
17:58who have bred dingo sections in Australia is not far from here. But yeah,  I don't know that.  I've never seen dingoes in the town  or even Canberra, our capital city is just on the edge of that national park. And we used to live there on that edge of town and we've never ever seen them in town. But yeah, I mean, they would come in and take chickens, but they're very, very shy of people.
18:27they don't tend  to. Do dingoes look like a small golden German Shepherd? I guess I could say that. Yeah. They're golden color normally. We also have the alpine which is white, almost a silver color.  But they're very, very rare.  But yeah, generally. Yeah, I guess that I'd never thought of them as I am.
18:57smaller German Shepherd. But yeah, they've got that sort of tail long hairy fluffy tail on the end like a German Shepherd.  And yeah, much smaller.  Well, here in Minnesota, I don't know if you even know where Minnesota is, but here in Minnesota, is  mid northern tier state of the United States.
19:23Um, we, have coyotes and foxes down where I am, cause I'm in the southern part of the state and there are actually gray wolves up north. and they were almost hunted to extinction and now they're bringing them back and they are so beautiful, Shell. They're a predator and they will take down moose and deer, but they are so gorgeous to look at. Yeah. Yeah. I've only ever seen them in.
19:52you know, videos and movies, but they are beautiful.  We also have timber wolves, which look like  they look like a cross between a coyote and a wolf. So, so like a medium haired coyote  or a medium haired wolf, if that makes any sense at all. And they're really pretty too. They're really gorgeous. So  we're really lucky. We have some very beautiful animals here in our state. We also  have,  um,
20:22Cougars.  Oh, wow. Yeah. And for the longest time, the Department of Natural Resources in Minnesota swore up and down that we did not have big cats in Minnesota.  And then people started catching them on trail cams. And I was like, huh, those prints I saw down by the river definitely looked like a cougar print 20 years ago. They were cougars. So we have  the golden, short-haired cougar cats.
20:52here. And there you don't see them very often. They do not like people at all.  They will not come near a person unless they have to. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. have really interesting animals in Australia. I don't know that I call most of them beautiful, like kangaroos.  They're interesting looking, but I don't know that I call them beautiful. When they're joey, they're very cute. When they're small, they're very cute.
21:23You know, as large animals, they're not quite so cute.  I mean, they're beautiful in their own way, I guess, especially the wallaby. The wallaby is a smaller cousin of the kangaroo.  Yeah, wallabies are adorable. Kangaroos are impressive. Yeah, that's right. Yes, exactly. I mean, we have wombats and we have lots of very placid, I mean, kangaroos aren't placid, but lots of very placid, shy animals in Australia.
21:53as our natives. know, platypus is beautiful.  Unless you  live in Tasmania,  their platypus are not shy. They are different, like a cousin to the mainland platypus.  But a mainland platypus is  very shy and you are very lucky if you see one.  And yeah, so I don't know, we just have lots of small
22:20koala as well also very shy animals.  Yeah we have lots of  furry, fluffy, marsupial natives that are very shy but almost none of them like very few. Tasmania has a few actually Tasmania has some more predator animals we used to live in Tasmania years ago.  They have the Tasmanian devil
22:46which is a predator,  mostly a scavenger animal,  but they will hunt if they have to, but mostly they'll just pick up something they find that's already dead. But then they have the southern quoll, and the quoll is very predatory, especially to chickens. You have to be very careful with those when you've got chooks. Yeah, they will break into anything. They've got,  we're pretty sure they've got opposable thumbs and can pick locks.
23:15A bit like your, what is it, bandicoots, I think, is it? Or? Raccoon? Raccoons, thank you. Yes, they're a little bit like a raccoon that will get in pretty much anywhere if you're not careful.  What is it called again? It's called a quoll. Q-U-O-L-L. Okay.  It's a caution quoll, it's called.  But  there's a few of them.
23:42On western part of Australia, in Western Australia, we have Poles  and they are around here in the southern states, but there's not many of them and they're not anything that we would ever consider to be concerned about.  But in Tasmania, yeah, they're quite a predator. In Tasmania, it's interesting.
24:08Well, for my listeners, if anybody  wants to see a baby platypus, go on YouTube and type in baby platypus when you have time because they are the most adorable baby critter I've ever seen. They are indeed. They're amazing. They're very beautiful. And echidna is another really cute one as well. They're actually mostly related to a platypus. The most related animal to a platypus is our echidna.
24:36They look like a hedgehog, sort of, but they're nothing, they're not related to a hedgehog at all, they have,  yeah, but they're related to platypus. They're quite a beautiful little animal,  full of spikes, so you don't pick them up very easily.  My dad used to joke that the platypus was the animal that God put together with the leftovers of everybody else. We always say God's clearly got a sense of humor. Look at the platypus.
25:05Uh-huh, exactly. Yes.  So  I don't want to get too far  much further afield here, but do you have poisonous snakes and poisonous spiders?  Oh, yes. Yes, we have plenty of them. Yes. We have,  I think we have seven of the top 10 world's most dangerous spiders in the world.
25:32But  we don't have bears or hookahs  or... So yeah, and I think it's very similar for our spiders as well. Yeah. So we have some of the world's  most dangerous deadly spiders  as well.  So you have some of the world's most deadliest snakes and spiders.  Uh-huh.  Yeah. Wow.
25:59There's a reason I live where the air hurts my face six months out of the year because we don't have poisonous snakes or poisonous spiders where I live. No, that's true. They would not survive.  And winter's a lot nicer because even our winter is cold enough that they hibernate. So we don't see them generally speaking in the winter. Okay. So that leads me into my next thing.
26:24I said at the beginning of the episode that you are in the middle of autumn and we're in the middle of spring. So  when I talked to Kate, Kate is the one that suggested that you and I chat.  She was telling me about this because when I talked to her, she was rolling into summer and we were rolling into winter here. And she was saying that she tries growing things in the winter, but it doesn't always work. So do you try to grow anything in the winter time? Yeah.
26:54Our climate's a little bit different to Kate's. So she's down near Melbourne and we're nearer Sydney or actually halfway between Melbourne and Sydney almost, but a bit nearer to Sydney. And we are up in the mountains. So we've got altitude. So summer here gets quite hot. So it gets to a hundred here most, like not most days, but you know, if it hits a hundred, we're like,
27:23It's a hot one today. know, so it gets quite hot here. So there's lot, actually a lot of vegetables we can't grow here in the summer because it's too hot. So any of the lettuces and spinaches, any of that sort of category, we generally can't grow here in the winter, I mean in the summer.
27:48So we actually would, I would normally plant those. They would be out, well, I've got some in little baskets on my background on my back deck.  And we will eat those right through the winter.  Because while we do get frosts, we don't get hard frosts. And so  we're not high enough for the soil to freeze,  but we're high enough that we do get some frosts regularly. Like most mornings we'll get a light frost.
28:18Okay. In America, in the frost country, it's called a light frost. Here in Australia, we call it a good frost.  But it's not a hard frost, not a freeze. So it's only in the very, very highest parts of Australia that we actually get a frozen soil. And even then, it's only maybe at the most it would be like.
28:46Maybe in the very, highest country where we've got snow for most of the year, it would be maybe a quarter, maybe. Most of our, know, where we live and stuff, certainly a couple inches deep, if it freezes. So yeah, so we actually do grow in the winter. So I will grow all the, I will often grow all the little wet.
29:12winter things and stuff like that. And I might just put a cover over them to stop them getting frostbitten. But they certainly  keep growing and producing for us. Once they've got to be mature, so they need to be mature about now,  sort of by  certainly  late April. We'll be expecting a frost in the next couple of weeks.  And so they have to be at a mature stage by then. But then if
29:41If they're mature, then we can grow them through the winter if we just protect them from the overnight frost with a bit of plastic or whatever, a bit of sea that extends or something. That is so awesome, Shell, because we can grow cold weather crops in our hard-sided greenhouse, but we can't grow that stuff outside. Not in the wintertime. no, you wouldn't find them, would you? They're too much to go on the ground.
30:10Um the last couple of years there's been hardly any snow where we live we have not even gotten a foot of snow this winter Wow Yeah, the climate is a little is a little screwed up right now  It ebbs and flows doesn't it?  You know I remember even just in my lifetime I've seen it ebbing and flowing  But yeah, okay, well there you go. Not even a foot  Yeah this winter
30:40this winter and last winter. So two winters in a row now, we have had hardly any snow, but  we have definitely had very cold  stretches of weather in the winter. So it's still,  it's still cold and windy. It's just not snowing. And I guess, I guess that's good. don't know. Okay. So  it's really interesting to me when I talk to people in other countries that are so far away because
31:09You know how it is, you grow up in one area  and  you think that the whole world is like where you live. And  it's so hard for my brain to flip to the fact that it's morning where you are and it's also autumn and we're talking to each other right now. know technology, right? It's amazing. I love it. I think it's great. I have  a bittersweet relationship with technology. I love it and hate it all at once.
31:39I love it when it works. I hate it when it doesn't. Exactly. Yes.  But yeah, it's pretty amazing, isn't it? I know I'm  on an online Bible study once a week and there's some women in that, or most of the women in that are from right across the states. And so we have it again, we have it in the morning and they have it in the evening.  And it's just so funny because
32:07I mean here in Australia, most of us are aware that we're the opposite to everyone else in the world  because there's so few of us down this area, us in New Zealand and a few little islands and that's basically  it. But  it's really interesting when we talk to people from America, but also from Europe as well and they're just like, what? I can't believe it.
32:35That's the opposite. That's weird. can't. Yeah, like you. And my brain's not computing.  It's like time travel. It's like I'm talking to the future. It's amazing. Yes, because it's Thursday here.  it's still Wednesday for you. Yeah, I've still got five and a half hours before I get to Thursday.  Yeah.  And a good sleep between them.
33:02I hope so. That would be lovely. Yeah. was funny when I got up this morning and found your message from last night to say, you still good for the morning? And I was like, yeah, well, I've had a whole night's sleep since you messaged me.  Oh, I knew. I knew you were probably asleep when I sent it, but just wanted to make sure because I wanted to talk with you because this is actually really exciting for me when I get to talk to people in other countries.
33:32Yeah, no, well, it's exciting for me too. love it. It's really interesting.  Yeah, I talked to a lady in Canada  a  couple of weeks ago and she raises mini  horses.  And it was so fun talking to her because Canada is not a lot different than America. I mean, it is, but it isn't. And  she lives  like maybe, I don't know.
34:0124 hours away from me.  it was just like talking to my buddy across the street on the phone, you know? She was great.  So  anyway, I try to keep these to half an hour and I,  didn't really talk a whole lot about homesteading, but we talked about some of the stuff that might hurt homesteading. So I think we covered the  draft here. So.
34:29Thank  I mean, we could do this again another time if you wanted to. We could actually talk about homesteading more. Yeah, that would be great. But I also am always so curious about the differences between here and where the people I'm talking to are that this always happens. So yeah, you should come back and have a list of things that you're doing that are homesteading.  appreciate you taking the time to talk with Michelle. Thank you.  My pleasure. you for listening.
34:58inviting me on it's been lovely and when I my podcast I I will invite you back to mine.  I think that would be amazing I love that because I don't get interviewed I do the interviewing so that would be fun. Lovely yeah well it's  it's in progress at the moment but you know okay planning stage.  Awesome let me know when you have it ready to go I will come back and visit.
35:27Indeed we will. Thank you so much Mary, it's been a real blessing to talk to you today. It has been a pleasure, Michelle. Thank you so much.
 

Growin and Crowin

Today I'm talking with Megan at Growin and Crowin.
A Tiny Homestead Podcast is sponsored by Homegrowncollective.org.
If you'd like to support me in growing this podcast, like, share, subscribe or leave a comment. Or just buy me a coffee 
https://buymeacoffee.com/lewismaryes
00:00You're listening to A Tiny Homestead, the podcast comprised entirely of conversations with homesteaders, cottage food producers, and crafters, and topics adjacent. I'm your host, Mary Lewis.  A Tiny Homestead podcast is sponsored by Homegrown Collective, a free-to-use farm-to-table platform emphasizing local connections with ability to sell online, buy, sell, trade in local garden groups, and help us grow a new food system.  You can find them at homegrowncollective.org. If you're enjoying this podcast, please like, subscribe.
00:29Share it with a friend or leave a comment. Thank you. Today I'm talking with Megan at Growin' and Crowin'. Good afternoon, Megan. How are you? I am good.  I love that Growin' and Crowin'. I just talked to a lady this morning and Cluck is in her name. And had to be really careful that we pronounce the CL. Right? For sure. So Growin' and Crowin' is safe. That's a good one.  Yeah.
00:52So you're in Illinois. it gray? Because she was in Indiana and I'm in Minnesota. It's been gray and sprinkling to hear all day. It was sunny earlier, but now it's all overcast again. Yeah, it's it's spring like, isn't it? Yeah. Yeah. Never know what you're going to get from one day to the next. Oh, thank God. It's spring. I know how your winter was, but it seems like our winter was a blink of an eye and the longest winter at the same time, which is really weird.
01:20Right. Nothing compares to last year with all the snow we got. yeah, it always seems to take forever for spring to get here. Yeah. We, I was, I keep saying this. We have not had a lot of snow where I live for the last two winters. I don't think we've gotten a foot  either winter of snow. Yeah. We definitely got a big blizzard last year, but this year was not bad.  Well,  I  can't figure out if it's good or bad because my mom said that my grandpa
01:50who was a farmer and then worked for General Motors for a long time. He used to say that rain and snow were  God's fertilizer or something like that. Sure, because it gives the ground moisture for the whole year of planting season and gets them started.  Yeah, and so this not having snow  sometimes  is a blessing because the roads aren't dicey, but it can also wreak havoc when we're trying to get stuff in.
02:20It's a crap shoot. I keep saying that and I stand behind it. You just don't know how it's gonna go. Yeah. All right. So tell me about yourself and what you do growing and crowing.  Okay. So  it's my husband and I live, like I said, in West Central Illinois and we have an 85 acre farm or homestead or you know, whatever you want to call it.  We have three kids  and  I do photography. I'm wedding and senior photographer mainly. So this is
02:49Hobby farm stuff at home is just a fun thing to do and keeps me busy. Okay. I always feel like I'm being nosy when I ask this question.  Do you try to have stuff from the homestead support the homestead financially?  So we don't do any sort of farmer's market or anything like that, really. It's just...
03:13like I raise catod and pear sheep. you know, my goal with them is if I can sell enough lambs for, to buy the next year's hay supply, then, you know, then we did good.  So,  so no, we don't, you know, my husband and I both work full time as well. So it's not,  it doesn't support itself. It's more just about, it makes me happy. It makes us happy and, you know, get to try new things and that sort of thing.
03:37Yeah, and happiness is a payoff all on its own. So I don't blame you. If we could have done 85 acres, we would have too, but we did 3.1 instead. Yep. Well, that's we bought it, you know, at 21 and initially we bought it because we want to hunt and ground. We all hunt. And so that's why we wanted the ground we got. And we do all hunt on it. So. Nice. What do you hunt for? Mainly deer, turkey. The boys do some coyote hunting, that sort of thing, squirrel hunting.
04:08Yeah, my youngest still lives with us. He's 23 and he's always plinking rabbits because the rabbits eat our garden.  if he sees a rabbit, he's like,  um, I see a bunny and I'm like, uh-huh. He's like, I'm going to take care of it. I'm like, you do that. That would be great. So I have a question about the deer. I  do not love venison as a meat. I grew up with parents who hunted and  they loved it, but  I did not.
04:37It's very, it's too close to the way that liver tastes to me and I just can't, I can't do it.  And I love liver but...  Yeah, I cannot.
04:49Cannot do it, just the smell of it makes my stomach flip. I'm like, no. That's probably 95 % of what we eat. So we'll raise cattle every now and again. When the prices aren't so dang high, then we can buy them just as feeder calves. But we put the venison in our freezer and sell the beef. So it's just kind of our kids are used to it. That's what they were brought up on. And that's what we use pretty much every day.
05:16Yeah, I was brought up on venison too. Every time my mom cooked, I was like, Oh no. I would, I would do my best to get it down, but man, I, I don't think I will ever eat venison again as an adult. just, cannot do it and all of power to people who love it. it. Please have my. No, no, I just don't like it, but that means more for everybody else. Right? There you go. Yeah.
05:46And turkey,  I hear that  wild turkey meat is very different than what you get at the store. Is that true? It is. mean, like with a wild turkey, it's tough. know,  there's not much other than kind of breasting them out and you can cook the leg meat, but it's so dang tough. But yeah, we'll usually, Erin will throw the turkey breast on the smoker and that's the meal out of that. Okay. Yep.  Alrighty. Cool.
06:16Um,  so I was looking at your Instagram page and  obviously you're a photographer. The photos on your Instagram page are beautiful. Thank you. Yeah. I, I didn't realize you were a photographer. And when I was looking at the pictures, I was like, Oh my God, who is doing her photos?  Now I know. Yeah. Well, and honestly,  pretty much all of them are just my iPhone because it's what we have in our pocket. And,  I can, you know, quick.
06:46pull it out for a photo in the yard or whatever I'm doing. I very rarely carry my work camera  around home.  Just because it's work.  Yeah, it's amazing how far photography, know, the tools for photography have come. Yes. That you can get photos that that good from your iPhone is just crazy.  Yeah, I've always been, you know, a storyteller and...
07:11I started out scrapbooking when our oldest son was  first born. so that kind of got me into, know, pushing me into the photography world. And then I went full time with it.  I'm just,  my kids are so used to getting their pictures taken anymore. And even their friends come over now and they just know  like  there's going to be photos taken and they're just all cool with it.  good. I'm glad because I'm not a person who wants to be photographed or videoed.
07:40And I know that it makes it hard for the photographers and I'm sorry.  My husband  is the one who really like screws around with taking photos on his phone. Yeah. And he took one the other  night or morning. think it might've been sunrise between where our pole barn is and where our wood burning boiler  is outside.  And the light is such that it looks like an oil painting.
08:07It  is the most beautiful photo he's ever taken that I've ever seen.  I posted on Facebook and I was like, this looks like a painting to me.  And like four or five of my friends commented and they were like, you need to print this out and get it framed. This is beautiful. Cool.  So yeah, I  love, love, love, love people who can take photos like that. And I don't think he even realized how gorgeous it was going to be. think he was just like, hmm, the light's interesting. Let me catch that.
08:37Neat. Yeah. That's part of it is just recognizing that light and  I will always be like, hurry up. got to go. The light's perfect right now. It's going to go away. huh. Yep. Yep. We're losing the light.  Uh huh.  Okay.  Um, let me see. I, there was a photo of,  um, soaps. Were those soaps that you made?  Yeah. So, um, I don't, it's not a business or anything. It's just something that I wanted to try. think, you know, part of being a creative person is you want to
09:06try a million things.  So I did it a couple years ago and actually my husband prefers it and he's like, we need to make some more soap. So  that was kind of my goal  over the winter and it kind of, you know, trailed into the spring. But when we  process, we have process all around me. And so when we processed hogs this last time, we rendered down all the lard. And so we had, you know, quite a bit of lard in the freezer. So  I use that up making, making soap. So it's, it's fun. It's time consuming.
09:36But it's fun. And that's the cold process, lye soap that you Yes. Yeah, that's, I've never tried the other, so just that one. Yeah. The soaps in the picture look like marble. Yeah, the trying the coloring and the swirling is fun. I'm not an expert by any means and I usually probably cut it too early because I'm excited to see what it looks like, but it's a lot of fun. As long as you cut it after 24 hours, you're safe.
10:05Oh good. I usually try to wait three to four days. So I'm doing okay. I'm doing all right.  Yeah. We always cut ours the next  like 24 hours from them from the time it's  Okay. Then it's then it's still kind of soft and the knife goes through it easier. Yes. Okay. And I always worry about like the trails that the knife makes, you know, cause I'm like, shoot, maybe I cut it too early, but then I'm like, oh, that's part of it. It's all right. Yeah. It makes everyone different.  Um, wow, that was a squeak. Sorry about that.  Um,
10:35Uh, we actually bought a soap cutter, you know, like a, I don't even know how to explain it. It's a machine for cutting soap and it's just,  it's got a wood base and it's got a wire that you drag through the soap to cut it. And that thing is worth its weight in gold. It's so  nice because you get such uniform sizes.  We love it. It's fantastic.
11:01And I was the same way. My husband tried making soap years ago, the same  cold process thing. And I loved it because store-bought soaps make my skin itch.  And the soap that we made, it's great.  It  moisturizes my skin. I'm not itchy. It doesn't leave that  tightness on your face if you use it on your face.  And he hadn't made soap for a while.  And I was like, I'm going to have to buy store-bought soap.
11:31Right. Yeah. Not the same.  Yeah.  And I did. And I used it for a week and my skin was itchy and I was getting like little red spots on my arms. And I showed him and I said, can you please make soap?  And can I please buy a bar of cold process soap from someone until ours is done? And he was like, yes. He said, I didn't realize that the store bought stuff really bothered you that much. He said, but my God, you have little red.
11:59raised patches on your skin. And I said, yes, I don't know what they put in store bought soap, but it's not good. Yeah. Yep. So I get it. And  I, I try to convince everybody to use the cold process soap that somebody makes. Cause number one,  you're supporting a maker and number two, it's actually better for your skin. Yeah. Yep. And, I'm going to be saying things like that on this podcast till I die because no one knows, no one knows that this stuff is good for you. Right.
12:30But either way, I love that your soap looks like marble  countertops. It's really pretty.  Thank you. Okay, so how did you,  you said that you guys bought an 85 acre farm, basically. How come? What brought you to this? Well,  yeah, it was 2001. So obviously prices, you know, we're nowhere near what they are today.  Yeah. So when I say we bought 85 acres at the age of 21, people are like, oh my gosh, well,
12:59It was a little bit different time then.  I sound old by saying that.  yeah, we were looking for something that we  could hunt. We wanted a place that we could walk out our back door and go hunting. so we happened to cross this. It was down a gravel road. That's what we wanted.  Nothing on the main road, something kind of off the beaten path. And we were lucky enough to get it. Yeah, but what  brought you to learning the homesteading skills?
13:26Well, so the funny thing is like the whole homesteading thing,  guess, like growing up where we're at, know, having the backyard garden and doing those kind of things, it was just normal.  It wasn't really called homesteading.  Right. Yeah. I grew up my parents always had a big garden and stuff and we didn't have livestock or chickens or anything. And I think that's kind of one of the reasons now I'm like, give me all the things  because.
13:52I wanted those animals. I wanted to show at the fair and  do those kinds of stuff, but  we just didn't have that. so it started with chickens, like a lot of people's stories and just kind of snowballed from that.  Okay. Yeah. And it's interesting because I ask people how they got here to wherever they are when they're talking to me.  And I usually get one of two answers. Either I was a city person  and I was sick of it and I wanted to try something else and this is where I ended up.
14:22Or my parents or my grandparents or both, D all the above, had gardens, had animals, had dogs, had cats, and I wanted that too.  So I always ask because it's always interesting to hear the origin story. Okay, what else can I ask you? I saw pool noodles.  What's the story there?
14:48That is so funny. And we were just laughing so much in the store that it was like, okay, we got to get a video of this. But so a couple of weeks ago, we had some storm damage  and we have a hoop shed for my, that's for my lambs.  It blew the each end off of the canvas. And so  Erin's going to have to  take some sort of like siding material or metal material  to rebuild those ends. And so in order to  keep that from like,
15:18uh, wherein holes are, you know, kind of ruining the canvas around it. We needed a way to kind of make a barrier. And so, um, he was looking at like the, I don't know, it's called piping, something for pipes or something, you know, where you cover like insulation or whatever for pipes, but it was expensive. Well, the pool noodles were half the cost. So here he comes walking through Menards with a full box of purple  pool noodles. I'm just laughing and  I like the amount of people that would just look at us and they were like,
15:47What are you doing? Or you're not supposed to buy a mall or all the comments we got just walking out of the store was hilarious. But  yeah, it's nothing crazy exciting. It's literally going to be to fix a barn that we lost in the storm.  And you say it's nothing crazy exciting,  but it is exciting because you're illustrating my thing  that I love to say about homesteaders being resourceful. Right.  That is true. And ingenious and thrifty.
16:16Yes, thrifty there. That's a good one.  Yeah. I mean, we try to not spend money on anything here if we don't have to, because why would we? Yeah. And there's a place like,  I don't know, maybe  seven miles away.  It's a  veterinarian  medical supply  company. they're always getting supplies  in.
16:42and they come in on pallets and they give the pallets away. They just leave them out by their dumpster and like, if you want them, take them.  And I'm not kidding.  I've been there when they've had 50 pallets stacked. And pallets are great for building things.  If you don't need it to be a super strong piece of  two by four, they're fantastic. And the thing that's great about this place is they have like two different styles of pallet and
17:10My husband has figured out that one style is good for one thing and the other one's good for another. So it's not uncommon for him to grab the pickup truck and the trailer and drive down there and come back with like 30 or 40 pallets and just stack them because he knows he'll need them and they're free. Yep.  Absolutely.  We've definitely done some stuff with pallets.  I think anybody who is on land has done something with pallets. Our woodshed thing.
17:38is the walls are made out of pallets and it's very funny. I remember watching my husband build it and I'm like, you know, we had the old one car garage that can't fit a car in these days out there. And he's, oh, that's full too. I'm like, oh, okay, good. Good to know. But you might need it someday. So, you know, you gotta keep it. exactly.
18:02So yeah, just, feel like people who are farming or homesteading or just own more than an acre tend to be people who are like, I could use that thing that's sitting there that nobody wants anymore. Yep. Collecting, hoarding, whatever you want to call it.  Let's use collecting hoarding. Hording sounds ugly.  It's organized hoarding. That's, you know, I'll call it that. exactly.  Did I see, did you say you have rabbits?
18:33I don't. So we have had rabbits in the past, so we have some cages and I keep teasing my husband that I'm gonna go get some rabbits so that we can use the fertilizers directly on the gardens and he thinks I'm nuts to  feed rabbits and pay for all the feed just  for fertilizer. But I'm like, we have the cages, why not? So we did when the kids were little, they each had a rabbit to take care of and stuff, but we haven't had them for a while, so we'll see.
19:00And you do know you can have meat rabbits, right? Right. that's what, yeah, that's what he said is only, you know, he's like, if you get like a Cali or something like that, but I'm like,  I put it, I want cute ones. So we'll see.  We had one, we had a California rabbit. Yeah. And she was the only one of the three rabbit, well, two females in the male.  She was the only female that gave us a litter in the course of a year.  Okay.  Our rabbits were so stupid.
19:28I talk about this a lot on the podcast because I want people to understand that just because you have big plans they don't always work out.  Right. Our bunnies were dumb. They did not get the memo that they were supposed to procreate easily. And we had  one litter of babies and  sweetest things ever. I I held a baby rabbit every day for months  because they are, if you hold them from the beginning, they're not afraid. They don't mind being held.
19:57And when we we dispatched them, I couldn't be around it. I told my husband, I said, when you're ready to put these guys down and bring their bodies in,  they must be footless, tailless and headless and skinless because I can't see them with anything that reminds me of what they were. Right. It makes you feel bad, but it's something that you've grown yourself. So yes. And I felt bad. I felt like a terrible homesteader because I didn't want to be part of all of it. But I was just like, I'm either going to throw up or cry or both. So you really don't want me out there.
20:26No, I just had that conversation with a friend the other day because she had, they raised Katahdin sheep as well and they were selling their lambs at the sale barn and she said she got in the vehicle and just started crying and I said, you know, I feel like if we didn't have that emotion or that tie to the livestock or the land, you know, I don't think it's right. You know, I think that's part of it and I think that shows that, you know, you're human. So.
20:50I am such a softie, you will laugh. We had barn kittens, the first litter of barn kittens. We had  three over a year or so.  And we were very excited to find homes for them. And the last two kittens found a home together, which was great. And I was all good with this. And the mom and dad got out of the car  and they had two little kids with them. I think they were like four years old and two years old.  And I'm standing in the door watching these kids just light the hell up about these baby cats.
21:20And I was so excited and so happy that these kittens were gonna go somewhere where they would be loved. And the minute they pulled out of the driveway, I just burst out in tears. My husband was like, what is wrong with you? I'm like, I'm a girl, number one. I'm over 50, number two. I said, I'm so happy and sad at the same time, I can't even function. He was like, why are you sad? I said, because those were our baby cats. I know there's somebody else's. And he's like, oh my God.
21:50I said, I said, just, just give me a minute. I'll be fine. And he's like, you're really crying. And I said, well, yeah, I said, I cried everything, you know me,  but it was so weird. Like my, had this big happiness bubble in my chest and I had this terrible pit of sad in my stomach at the same time.  It was ridiculous. I don't want to do it again.  So when the next two litters found Holmes, I was like, bye kitties. It was nice knowing you enjoy your new life. And then I was fine. Right.
22:22So there are things that will just catch you entirely off guard in  this lifestyle.  And honestly, when  the first garden that we put in here,  four summers ago now,  when it came time to put the garden to bed  for the fall,  I definitely had a tear in my eye because I was like, was our inaugural garden and we're done.  Right.
22:52It's just weird.  I feel like I get way too attached to stuff that I shouldn't get attached to. I think this might be the wrong lifestyle for me, but I really do enjoy most of it. So,  okay. So what you said, you said you had a bad storm and it messed up your,  your sheep shed, sheep, whatever. Yeah. So it was, it just knocked over our little, like, we have a little garden shed in our yard and it just came through and  just wiped it out and then.
23:20You know, did some damage to the end of our hoop shed. So it was the weirdest thing. Didn't damage the house. My greenhouse was sitting next to the shed that it took out. Didn't touch that. So we got lucky, but we got some stuff to clean up and I guess it's given us some stuff to do for the spring for sure. when, when was this? Um, just like three weeks ago. Oh, so it was a winter storm. Okay. Well,
23:44No, mean, it was well, yeah, when I guess early spring, but yeah, it was just like it wasn't a tornado, but I could see like, like, I called it a dust tornado that came across the field across the road from us. And it was just went so fast. So it was a baby tornado. Yeah, that's kind of what I referred to it as. Yeah. I'm telling you, this weather has been so crazy for the last two years.
24:11I really, really am keeping my fingers crossed that this particular year is better because it's been rough where we live for  growing anything.  I kind of would like to have a pretty garden again. Right. Yeah. And a productive garden again. That would be helpful.  If I can keep up with the weeds, that's the biggest thing.  Yes.  Yes. And we let our garden go last year. It was so hard to get anything in.
24:41because we had six weeks of rain.  We just grew some tomatoes. We grew some cucumbers. I think I got three decent cucumbers out of a out of two  20 foot rows of cucumbers. got three cucumbers. Yeah. Yeah, we used to do a huge in-ground garden. And actually next year we were able to salvage some old hog feeders from a farmer around us. And so we put our entire garden into raised beds.
25:11Um, and so last year was our first year with that. And I just thought, is so silly. We're taking away, you know, all this area that we had and could grow so much food, but then it's like, well, if it's just one of the waste or it's going to the weeds and it's no good either. So, so far those raised beds have been better just as far as me being able to go out and keep up with the weeds and stuff. So. I feel like it gives you more control over what is happening. Yes.
25:39Because when you just stick stuff in the ground, Mother Nature is in control and you can maybe curb it a little bit.  Yeah. Yeah.  Yeah. My husband is the gardener. I used to garden. I don't love it anymore, but he still does. And he was just so crushed at the end of June last year because he could not get anything in the garden. It was just soup.  And  I said, are you going to blow up at some point? And he's like, no. said next year is going to be better. I said, okay.
26:09Because you guys are Minnesota, right? Yes. Yes. Okay. I wasn't sure how far up you were from us, but Yeah, we are about an hour north. Well, maybe an hour and a half north of the Iowa border Okay, so not far Yeah, it just it rained for six weeks here from yeah rain basically the first of May through mid-june I think it might have been mid-april through the end of May, but I don't remember but it was six weeks of rain every day
26:38I thought  we were going to mold. It was so  awful. was terrible. I hated every second of it. My dog. My God, when that six weeks ended and the sun finally came out and dried up the grass,  we let her outside and she realized that the sun was actually shining and the grass was not wet and she rolled for 10 minutes.  She's looking at me like, Mom, look, it's not wet outside.  It was great.
27:06And then she didn't want to come in, which was not great because, you know, I don't want her outside for four hours. She'll be all gross and dirty and I don't want to have to deal with that. but anyway, so I feel like we haven't talked about anything, but we really have. What's the future look like for your 85 acres? Are you just going to just keep having it make you happy or do you have any plans for it?
27:33Um, I mean, yeah, as far as like our biggest thing right now is I would say the Katahdin sheep kind of getting that going. And it's something that, you know, we used to do goats and then moved on to the sheep. A little bit easier to keep in fencing and that sort of stuff. So we're building our flock. I think I had 31 last year. So we had 42 babies. Um, and I've only got 17 of those left. So, um, you know, it's
28:00do we build our flock and make it bigger or I don't know.  And we used to have, kind of reserved one pasture for  the cows that we would raise because like I said, we would buy them and feed them out and then we'd sell the beef.  But because of beef prices being so high, we just, the past couple of years, we can't justify buying them and then passing that cost on to, you know, our customers. So we were just like, well, let's run the sheep down there. And we did that last year and that was awesome. So
28:28So yeah, I think probably focusing on the sheep and mainly just  it's home. you know, the kids can come back and hunt here and they come back and we process the meat here.  so it just, you know, we're home bodies. I guess that's the biggest thing is like for me is if I'm gonna be home, I've got a lot of stuff to do and it keeps us really busy. So.  Yeah, I have two questions.  One is about the Katahdin baby sheep.
28:58or  baby sheep, lambs.  And the other one is about why  feeder calves are so expensive right now. So let's start with the calves. Why are feeder calves so expensive? Yeah, I don't know if it's a market thing  or I don't know. It's just cows are outrageous. You used to be able to pick up a bottle calf for like hundred bucks and I just seen one the other day on Facebook. It was 800 to a thousand dollars for a bottle calf.  I wonder.
29:25There's a lady that I talked to her Facebook page is Clear Creek Ranch Mom, she's in Nebraska.  And she was saying that a couple of years ago, a lot of cows have been put down because there was no market for them. So I wonder  if that's coming back to  bite people in the butt now because there aren't as many calves to buy. Yeah, I don't know.  Some people say it's a political thing. Who knows, but.
29:51You know, we're not big farmers, so we don't, I guess if you had a cattle farm right now, it's a good place to be.  But  yeah, we're not there. And like I said, we would have maybe eight cows at the most that we would  feed out every year. So just enough for our pasture to cover it. And  that was  kind of a good way to get started on a little bit of farm part of the life.
30:19Okay, so you've switched to the the hair shape basically.  Yes.  The question I have about the lambs from the hair shape  is do they look pretty much the same as a wool sheep will look when they're babies? No, so the cool thing with the Katahdins is  they're all different kind of colors. So it's almost like raising the goats where you're not really sure what they're going to look like. They can be white, brown.
30:42We have some that have a Dorper, which is another breed. And so there's black in those.  So that's the kind of the cool part with them too, is you don't know what they're gonna look like. Not every one of them is gonna look exactly the same out there in the field. And  I have numerous of my ewes that are named  because I know who's who. And  so for me, that's the fun part.  With the hair sheep, they shed out so you don't have to have them sheared. So that's a big thing that takes out a huge.
31:10You know, obviously you don't have the wool to sell, but  it  takes outlacking to do that. There's no market for wool right now anyway, from what I'm hearing. So, right. I don't think so.  Uh huh. So I guess  I phrased the question slightly wrong for the answer I was looking for.  Oh, sorry. The wool sheep when they're babies, they're not like really fluffy. They're soft, but they're not.
31:38Clearly they haven't grown out their wool yet.  So are the hair sheep lambs like short haired?  Yeah, I mean, it's not a long. Yeah, I would say yes. And then, you know, as they grow, they'll get it gets longer and then they shed it out every year. So, yeah. Yeah. And I'm sure that wherever you have them, it looks like a snow storm hit your field. Yes. When they shed out in the spring, we always laugh that we have the most bougie bird nests around because  they grab all the hair off the fence.
32:07anything they've  rubbed up against. Yeah, I was going to say, I bet they're great for the birds. The birds probably love having all that to put in their nests. Yep. Yep.  I didn't know about hair sheep until a few years ago.  there was a guy that was raising hair sheep. And we had wanted to go see them because we were thinking about buying one for meat.
32:33And he was like, come on to the farm, come down, see the sheep. It's really kind of cool. And he was not that  lighthearted about it. was  kind of a gruff farmer guy.  And when we got there, it was when they were shedding and his whole pasture looked like snow. he  walked up and introduced himself and he was a gruff older guy. And I said, it looks like it snowed. And I was not being a smart ass. I was just making a comment.
33:02And he said, yeah, they're shedding right now because they're not wool sheep, they're hair sheep. And my ears perked up and I said, um, I don't, I don't know anything about hair sheep.  What's,  what's that? And then he smiled and his shoulders came down and he was like,  let me tell you a story and was teaching me all about the hair sheep and the different breeds and da da da. And he said, so basically their hair is worthless except for the birds.
33:31Right.  Yep. I said, so you're raising hair sheep for the birds? And he laughed. Oh my God. He laughed so deep. was like, huh, I guess that was funnier than I thought.  And, and he says, he says, well, no, he says, I'm raising them for meat. said, but I might as well be raising them for the birds. He said, because every bird nest in the spring has some of their, their hair in it. Yep.  I was like, okay, cool.  And he said, so he said, what do think of the farm? And I said, I think that your, your sheep are a
34:01adorable  and He said yeah, they eat a lot and I said  good I said because we might want to buy some you know We might want to buy one from you that you send to the butcher and we put in our freezer  He was like  that would be fabulous He said let me know when you want to do that and he said  and thank you for visiting my farm He said I forget that people don't know about hair sheep. Mm-hmm
34:24And he was very genuine and I was like, went from standoffish gruff to really nice in like a half an hour. This is great. Yeah. He has sparked what he liked to talk about. exactly. So that's why I was asking about the hair sheep babies because I didn't see any lambs because it wasn't the right time of year. Oh, sure. Yep. Which was heartbreaking to me because I love baby animals. I would have been thrilled to be hanging out with baby sheep. That would have been great. Oh, yeah.
34:51So anyway, we're at 30, well, almost 35 minutes and I try to keep this to half an hour. So, Megan, thank you for your time and keep doing what makes you happy. It pays off in so many ways. Thank you. All right. Have a great day. You too. Thank you. Bye.
 

Misty Mountain Homestead - Catch Up

Today I'm talking with Kelsey at Misty Mountain Homestead. This a follow up chat about what Kelsey has been up to since November of 2023.
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00:00You're listening to A Tiny Homestead, the podcast comprised entirely of conversations with homesteaders, cottage food producers, and crafters, and topics adjacent. I'm your host, Mary Lewis.  A Tiny Homestead podcast is sponsored by Homegrown Collective, a free-to-use farm-to-table platform emphasizing local connections with ability to sell online, buy, sell, trade in local garden groups, and help us grow a new food system.  You can find them at homegrowncollective.org. If you're enjoying this podcast, please like, subscribe.
00:29share it with a friend or leave a comment. Thank you. Today I'm talking with Kelsey at Misty Mountain Homestead. Good morning Kelsey. How are you? Good morning Mary. I'm doing great. Good. I almost called you Misty. I was, I almost said I'm talking with Misty at Misty Mountain Homestead.  That's where my brain's at  this morning. That happens to me  very, very often actually.  Yup. My brain not functioning, words not working. We'll get it together eventually.
00:57Where are you in Minnesota? told me before, but I forgot. We live in South Haven, Minnesota, but we're actually closer to Fairhaven, but Fairhaven doesn't have a post office, so it's a South Haven address. Okay, so what's the nearest big city to you? We're about 20 miles south of St. Cloud. Okay, yep, that helps. Thank you. Is it gray? Is it gray up there today?
01:26Oh, yes, very foggy, very gray. huh. Yeah, I was all excited because Wednesday was supposed to be the official real swinging into warm weather spring.  And the last couple of days have been kind of bleh. Yep, that's true.  I'm waiting for the pretty sunny days where the crocuses start to pop up and that hasn't happened yet.  Okay, so Kelsey came back to visit and do a catch up episode with me.
01:55And I looked and the first episode Kelsey and I did was back in November of 2023. And I started the podcast in August of 2023. So it's been a minute since we've chatted. tell me what's happening since then.
02:14Um, well, we've really added to our meat rabbit colony. Um, we have probably close to, um, 60 rabbits right now. Um, I would say 15 of them are our breeders. Okay. And, um, we have been selling and butchering those ourselves and that's been, um, a really good adventure. Um, lots of.
02:42teaching moments for us and the kids both.  And we're starting to learn how to tan their hides as well.  A long-term goal, I would love to learn how to like make hats.  Cause  their hides are just so beautiful and I really don't like seeing them to go to waste.  And we've also started using,  you know, every part of the animal, their ears, their legs,  feet  as dog treats.
03:12And you just dehydrate them and they turn into chips.  Okay. Um, yeah.  And,  um, that's been  really, really fun. And of course the dogs enjoy it as well.  So,  and we also have cooney cooney pigs now. Okay.  Um, we're going to start breeding those,  um, and the selling the piglets and then of course,  um, having some meat for ourselves.
03:40CUNY CUNY pigs are extremely high quality pork. Their meat looks more like beef and it actually has marbling in it. And then once you eat like CUNY CUNY or Mangleesa is also another high quality pork, it's really hard to go back to like more of a normal pig like a Yorkshire. But yeah.
04:09So I have a question. have a question about that real quick.  so if it looks more like beef, does it have the same kind of texture and flavor or does it still taste like pork? Well, I think it has the same texture as pork, but it definitely has a very  rich flavor.  Um, I would say more even so than beef does.  but yeah.  Okay, cool. I just, I've never had either.
04:38kind so I thought I should ask. Okay and I told you before I hit record I've been looking at your Facebook pages because I wanted to see what you've been up to and you make some of the most beautiful breads ma'am. Oh thank you very much. And other things. It's been quite the process. So you've really gotten into baking since we talked last I think so tell me about that too.
05:05You know, it's been  a little bit surprising. Um, and I'm kind of just along for the ride  and,  I have had wonderful customers  and farmers and,  Just people show up out of the woodwork.  Uh, and I'm kind of just doing things that I would do for my family. And then I, you know, increased it by scale.  Um, which
05:34was really easy for me actually.  And, um, I started with a little KitchenAid mixer and I burnt through a couple of those motors. Uh, and I have a, now I have a 15 quart like professional mixer. And I remember being really nervous about buying that.  And my husband's like,  Oh, it's only, you know, 50 loaves of bread. He, he likes to encourage me.
06:02how many loaves I'd have to sell for something I need to buy.  But anyway, so I've had that for a couple years now and now it's too small.  Wow. Okay. So I'm probably going to have to look at getting a 30 quart mixer, which could make 20 loaves at one time.  So it's been nuts.
06:28I probably make a hundred to 120 loaves of sourdough a week. Um, I also do pizza dough and sourdough buns and pies. So many pies. think for Thanksgiving and Christmas this last year, I made like 90 pies. you do cookies too, Cookies, scones.
06:58Yeah, dipping oil.  Yeah, I do quite a bit,  I guess. Okay, I have two questions. I have a KitchenAid mixer and I think it's a six quart one. It's a bigger one.  And we haven't burned through it yet. We just bought it like a year and a half ago and we have not used it much really. I I thought when I bought this big one, we'd use it a lot and  been busy with other stuff like a podcast that I didn't know I was going to be doing when I bought the mixer.
07:28But we have burned through two KitchenAid mixers in the 20 something years that we've owned KitchenAid mixers. And it's so sad when they die. You're like, no, you're supposed to live forever. No. And so they're a great, they're a great brand. I love them, but I am so envious of the fact that you have that huge mixer because I really want one. I just have no room for it in my kitchen. I have very little counter space. So.
07:58So the question I have is how much bigger than a five and a half quart KitchenAid mixer is the one you have now that's a 15 quart? Well, I think a normal size KitchenAid mixer is like 15 pounds maybe. The one that I have that's a 15 quart, this thing weighs 200 pounds. Wow. It sits on the ground.
08:29So,  um, it doesn't need any special outlet, which is really nice.  Um, it's got  tons of safety features, but,  uh, it's, it's a workhorse. It's, um, I've been really pleased with it.  Is it, is it loud?  Uh, I mean, it's  my kids will be sleeping at 4am and they,  a couple of them sleep downstairs  and I can obviously hear the mixer going, but they don't ever wake up.  Okay.
08:59So I don't think it's terribly loud.  I asked because our dog hates the vacuum cleaner. Like goes to the door and sits there and whines because she hates the vacuum cleaner so much she wants to go outside.  And she hasn't reacted to the KitchenAid mixer, but I suspect that if the motor was louder, she probably would want to go outside then too. Okay. Yeah.  Yep. So I don't know. She's a big afraidy cat with the vacuum and I
09:28I cannot figure out why no one has ever  bothered her with it. She hates it. does she, um, is she afraid of storms too?  No, no.  it last summer we got a really close lightning strike. So, you know, you, you could hear the thump when it hit the ground  or the tree  and she just was like, woof. And she was fine.
09:53Oh my goodness. Yeah, she's not. She's not afraid of storms, but that vacuum cleaner is the devil itself, she thinks. That's me. I don't know. She's crazy. Um, okay. I had another question on the other stuff you told me and then I got focused on the mixer and I forgot what I was going to ask you because my brain is not great this morning. Um, so how much time are you putting into baking? Cause I know that making a dozen cookies,
10:22to put it together, to put the ingredients together and have it ready to go in the oven is no different than making the recipe for 12 dozen. But once you get into the big, big numbers,  is it a lot more time and effort?
10:41Uh, well, partially with the, with the big mixer, like, uh, two days ago, I made like 25 pounds  of chocolate chip cookies in that mixer.  And  the, part that takes the longest obviously  is baking it all.  Um, I, I do, I have one standard, you know, wall oven that I bake my bread in, but then now I have a convection oven, um, that I do,  you know, the pies and the cookies in that. Um, so that's.
11:10been pretty nice.  I am kind of at the point where  we are debating about putting in a second oven.  Because that's my biggest hookup is  how long it takes me to bake stuff.  But I guess daily. I'm at the point where it's probably I'm probably working on the farm business for maybe four to six hours a day.
11:40Um, while being home with the kids and we're homeschooling and you know, we're pretty involved in church and of course there's animals that need to be fed and,  um, cleaning,  you know, so I,  it feels like a full-time job to me. I've been a stay at home mom is, um, it's a, it's a good, very good responsibility. feel. Yeah. And I, I, I've said it before and say it again, I love that you are able to do your, your business.
12:10and be there with your kids because you are giving them such a gift in being there with them. Yeah, and it's a gift for me too. You know, and  when we first thought about  homeschooling, I remember us being nervous about it. You know,  we would always be together. There's never any break. And I wasn't sure, you know, as someone that, you know, did the normal, you know, public school stuff that was
12:37That was so like unnerving to me, but now that we've been doing it for five years,  we would never go back.  You know, they, the kids are amazing. They're mature and their faith is strong. And, um, they're just, they each have farm chores every day and,  you get to really spend time with your kids that way and you know what they're learning.  Um, so it's been a, huge blessing. so, you know, I, they also like, they see me working.
13:07but they also see me playing,  you know, I, I think there's a good, it needs to be a good balance of both, you know? And if it becomes too overwhelming, I just back off a little bit. And then usually within, uh, you know, uh, a couple of weeks I'm ready to go at it again, you know? So you kind of just take it in seasons. Yeah.  Yep. Absolutely.  Um,
13:31One of the tricks that I used with my kids from the time they were little until well now they're adults and I still use it when they're stressed or whatever  is humor. I'm always the first one to crack the joke so that they can laugh and take a big deep breath  because laughing forces you to take a big deep breath  and that's how you kind of bring stress down is that big inhale and exhale. So for anybody out there who's got kids that are stressing, just crack something.
14:01crack a joke that will make them take a big deep breath in a big deep breath out and get that bubble in their belly of happy. it'll, it'll, it'll break the tension a little bit. Yeah. I, I'm going to be real honest. I, I am a very serious person. I, I don't, uh, jokes are not something that come naturally to me. If somebody tells me a joke, um, it's usually I don't get it. Uh, and I'm very much more, uh, you know,
14:32just get stuff done, I'm doing this right now, but my husband is the exact opposite.  He is constantly cracking jokes  and he'll just be like, he'll make funny noises or  poke jokes at me.  it's really good that he's like that because, or else we would just all be serious all the time. Yeah. yeah, it's my husband's like that too. He is the king of dad jokes. I just talked about this with somebody else yesterday.
15:01And I am, I'm not a fan. I like really,  I like really clever humor. Like, like the stuff where you, you,  there's a split second of what and then you get it  because it's smart. It's a smart joke. And dad jokes are not like that. And my son that still lives with us, he really does appreciate a dad joke. So my husband does them to me and I'm like, it's not funny.
15:27He's like, well, Karen thinks it's funny. And I'm like, yes, because he's 23 years old and male. Of course he thinks it's funny. yeah, I'm more like you than I am like my husband in what I do. But I also learned really early on that if I could just get the kids to giggle, it made things easier. So I would find something I knew would make them giggle and then we'd be okay.
15:56I used it as a tool at work.  still use it.  My daughter called me months ago and  she was all bent out of shape about something. She's 35 years old. And  I said, okay, do you need a giggle? And she's like, kind of need a giggle. And I found something, I don't know what it was.  And she did. She giggled like she was five. And she's like, thank you. Now I can tell you what I need to tell you because this thing is driving me insane. And it just gave her that room to not be sobbing.
16:25not be crying in her frustration with the thing that was driving her crazy.  Anyway,  when we talked last, there was some  conversation going on about you having a farm store. Did that ever happen?
16:44Well, we are definitely getting closer.  We don't have the story yet, but we're actually, you know, in the active thought process of paying for the shed.  Um,  so that's been pretty exciting.  Um, I actually designed the shed online a few weeks ago.  Uh, so it's, it's, it's in the works.  Um, and we're planning, you know, how we're going to run electricity out there. So I.
17:12I'm pretty excited about that. That didn't really feel like it was attainable,  but now it obviously is. Cool. Good. And are you going to have  produce and eggs and baked goods in it or  what's the plan? What are you going to be selling out of it? Produce,  eggs.  We're also going to be, there will be a freezer in there.  We'll have  no corn, no soy chicken and no corn, no soy rabbit.
17:39There will be pizza dough and sourdough and candles. And I'm also wanting to do other people's products as well. Like if somebody has honey or somebody has maple syrup, just kind of supporting the community as a whole,  if I can in that way.  Fantastic.  Since we last talked, we have put in a farm stand. been up for two summers now, I think.
18:08And it looks like a little red barn. It's red with white trim. love this little building. And we put an old, um, a small refrigerator from a camper trailer in there and we run a, extension cord to it from the pole barn. And, uh, okay. And we have tables like folding tables that we put our stuff on to sell. And my husband says to me three weeks ago, he said, um, a couple of weekends in April, we're going to
18:37Cameron and I are going to be busy out there. And I was like, um, why? said, we're going to tape and mud the drywall and we're going to paint and we're going to put in some shelves on the walls and make it look nice. I was like, Oh, okay. I said, do you want any thing from me on that? And he was like, no. He said, I think we're just going to paint it off white because then it'll reflect the sun that comes in. And I was like, okay, that's fine.
19:04He makes beautiful shelves. Like I have a couple shelves from the old house that we brought to the new house that we've put up and  I end up finishing them. I'm the one that polyurethanes them, but he just does really beautiful, simple carpentry.  So I'm very excited to see what the inside of our farm stand is going to look like in June when we're ready to put produce and baked goods and stuff in it.
19:29Yeah, you'll have to share that on Facebook.  I will, cause that's, that's what I do.  I don't know if you've looked at my page lately, but I took,  he sent me photos of  the steps when he was done with each step when he built the greenhouse last year.  And  I would just throw pictures up every time he sent them to me because I'm like, this is so exciting. It's almost done. Yay.  So, so yeah, so we've put up a hard side of greenhouse since I talked to you last and that has been  a godsend.
19:59Because we extended our growing season by two months in the fall and two months in the spring.  I love it. I love it. It's packed full of seedlings right now.  Yup. mean, it's funny because you had all kinds of things that you were talking about and planning for and  we had all kinds of things we were talking about and planning for with the first episode with you.
20:28I think you were like the  11th or 12th episode I released to the podcast. And my husband was kind of listening to it a little bit when I was playing it back to get it ready  to go out. He said, I think they're kind of where we are in their journey with this. I said, I think so too. He said, you have got to talk to her again, like a year or two from now and see where they're at.  So he brought that up the other day. said, have you talked to anybody you talked to at the beginning? I said, a couple. said,
20:56What about that lady said, I can't think of her name, da da. And I went back through the episodes and I ran off the list and he said,  the Misty Mountain one. said, I remember because she was a Lord of the Rings fan or something. And I said, yeah. He said, you should, you should ask her. I was like, thank you for your input. will get hold of it right away.  So you made an impression on my husband anyway. Well, that's sweet.  But the reason I say all that is this is a journey.
21:25you know, what you're doing, what we're doing, what most homesteaders are doing  is a journey. It's not a destination, you know? Right. And it's so fun and it's so  frustrating some days because you're like, I want to do this thing. And then you get into it you're like, it's not working. How do I get this to work? And  big, big deep breath and sigh and figure it out.
21:52Yep. They're usually, the lessons are usually  very, very hard.  They're either really, really good or really, really bad.  yep. And we've had our share of both.  Oh yeah. Us too. And I don't want to say really, really bad. mean, nobody's been maimed or killed that's human here. So that's, that's good news. That does happen, but it doesn't happen here.  But we've lost barn cats and that was sad. We've lost.
22:20baby bunnies, that was sad.  We had  the motor go out on our furnace. That was bad.  was financially bad. And that was when it was so hot last summer.  And the furnace is actually the blower for the AC. So that was a few days of really miserable heat in my house.  But the good things that have happened is we had
22:48We've grown enough food to donate to our food shelf and that's been  wonderful. And we've  grown enough food to sell at the local farmers market and that just makes my husband thrilled. He's very, I don't have enough berries. He's very times a hundred social and I am not. the  farmers market is really good for him. He really loves going on Saturday morning and getting caught up with all the people he knows.
23:18So it's all kinds of really fun things that have happened since we moved here. And I love all of it. And even the hard things  are lessons I needed to learn.  what are the hard things that have happened for you? Well, I'm going to be real honest. guess one of the hardest things we had to go through was we  lost almost our entire rabbit colony last summer.
23:48Um, and we couldn't figure out why they were dying.  Um,  and my husband actually had a job change, but he was working road construction. So I was home most of the time by myself trying to, you know, deal with everything. Yeah.  And I would walk outside and they were just be bodies.  Oh no. You know,  and I, no matter what we thought it was, no matter what we gave them, it wasn't.
24:17stopping like them dying. But long story short, we ended up finding out that,  uh, they had bad hay.  Oh yeah. Uh, the hay was contaminated  and as soon as we figured that out and we removed all the, know, we moved, we didn't give them the hay. We burned that hay and then we like  really cleaned out,  um, their enclosures.
24:46And then they stopped dying,  but we, we lost probably like 55 rabbits for that.  Um, and I remember just crying about it because it just felt like, why are we even doing this? You know, I was,  um, felt,  obviously I felt terrible too,  you know, because we, do care about the animals and we try our best to take care of them, you know, for as long as we have them. And that was.
25:16That was pretty intense.  uh,  yeah.  Yup. But now, now, you know, now, you know that if something's wrong, check the food source too. Right.  And we've also realized that a rabbit is very similar to a horse,  uh, in regards to the quality of hay that they require. Um, it either needs to be like fresh picked  greens.
25:44or it needs to be like  straight alfalfa. So we started feeding them, uh, Timothy and alfalfa cubes.  Uh, and they're, that's actually really good for their teeth too. And then this way we know that the hay is clean.  yep. Alfalfa is,  Alfalfa is wonderful.  Um, I'm sad because we used to be surrounded by alfalfa fields and then the guys decided they were going to grow corn.
26:12So it's been corn the last two summers. And I don't know if you know this, but fresh alfalfa, like when it's growing in the field, blooms.  It has like little lavender and white flowers on it. And when we had our rabbits, we would go and kife a couple pieces of alfalfa off the corner of our lot, because the  farmer actually rounds the corner. So it's on our property.  And we would bring them sprigs of alfalfa and they loved it. Yes.
26:41So yeah, it's really good for them.  And our bunnies were fed Timothy Hay. We only had rabbits for a little over a year because they were not making babies.  Oh, yeah.  Yeah. Not impressed with that. They weren't earning their keep.  And six months after we culled our rabbits and put them in the freezer for food,  I was reading up on rabbits again.  And Timothy Hay can actually make them too fat.
27:11And if the female rabbits are fat, they don't conceive as easily. And I was like, well, there's my answer.  Now I know.  So we're not doing rabbits anymore. decided that  we were bad at it. So we're not doing rabbits anymore. And that's okay.  Yeah. But we have chickens because chickens are easier than rabbits. Yes. Yep.  So.
27:39But I'm sorry that you had to lose all those bunnies to find out it was their food, but I'm glad you found out it was their food, because then you could fix it. At first we thought it was some kind of weird parasite. And that was overwhelming, because it's really hard to know what it is. But so when we did realize that it was the hay, it was almost a relief in some way.
28:07because you can deal with the problem a lot easier as well.  Certainly. Yes,  absolutely. Okay, so I want to switch back to your baking really quick because we're almost a half an hour, but I have a couple of questions.  Are you still doing the baking as a cottage food producer or did you switch to commercial?  I am still a cottage food producer  and I did have to bump up.
28:33um, to a second tier license. And I did take the, the, the college classes  that I needed,  um, also, and I passed all that.  Um, but yep, I'm still underneath the cottage license. Okay.  And you're selling your goods at a local store. Is that right?  Um,  I do  a lot of farmers markets.  Um, also like the community has really picked up, you know,
29:03having lots of events.  Like different stores will have pop-ups and  I really think that's a really neat thing.  And people learn more about  different options for  food that farmers around the community have.  I do a lot of that, a lot of those.  Okay.  And do you,  I'm trying to get to this in a way that isn't rude.
29:31I always feel like I'm asking really noisy questions.  You're fine. With  the pop-ups, with the cottage food producer thing, the person that makes the food has to be at the point of sale to the customer. So does that mean that you have to be at the  pop-up sale? Yep. I have to be there.  the commercial license, you don't have to be there.
29:59And it means that you can ship and it means that you can sell in grocery stores if they wanted to carry your product. Is that right? That is right.  Um, actually I've been watching very closely, um, in the Minnesota legislature right now, uh, they are thinking about allowing cottage food bakers to  ship  their product.  And I was like, no way, you know, cause that would, that would open up a huge door.
30:28for everybody that has a cottage license.  So  it certainly would. And I have my registration and there was a lady that emailed me or messaged me and said, can you ship your granola? And I said,  no, how far away are you? And she said like four hours north of Lasur. And I said, you don't want to drive four hours from my granola.  And she said, no. And I said, I can't afford to drive four hours to bring it to you. And she said, I would never expect you to.
30:58She said, how come you can't ship? Because she didn't know about  the rules.  And I explained it to her. And she said, please keep me in your contacts.  if and when they finally allow you guys to ship,  I still want to buy it. And I thought that was so sweet that she didn't put a time limit on it. Now, the other thing that  I got the email that mentioned this thing that you're talking about, I got the email that  had it in it the other day.
31:26And I went out to the Facebook page for the Minnesota Cottage Food Producers Association thing. And there was a comment about if it goes through, we'll only be allowed to ship in Minnesota.  Oh, interesting. And I don't know if that's correct. So I'm hoping that  maybe it is incorrect and maybe we actually will be able to ship nationwide or worldwide or whatever. don't know. So I'm very excited to watch how this turns out because
31:55It's been floated a few times over the last couple of years about allowing cottage food producers to ship and it just hasn't gotten passed. So  I'm hoping this is the year Kelsey really am.  Yeah, that would be pretty awesome. Yep. And what makes me so frustrated with it all is my daughter made cookies last Christmas for me specifically and shipped them to me. But
32:23It's not a big deal if it's like family who's just shipping you a treat. Right. That's fine. there's no rules.  And my mom asked me if I could ship her something.
32:36And I said, of course I can make those and ship them to you. That's fine. I'll throw them in the overnight mail. No big deal. And then she called me just before I was getting ready to make whatever it was. I don't remember what it was now.  And she said, by the way, she said, don't make those. And I said, why? And she said, because someone just brought us  a tray of cookies. It's my dad and my mom.  She said, and there's lots. we don't have, we don't need anything else right now. And I was like, oh, okay, well, just let me know.
33:04But I could have shipped her the thing I was making. No problem. it's very frustrating. And I always get real tight in my voice when I talk about it, because it's,  it's so frustrating to me that we can't do this yet. Right.  Right. So fingers crossed that this is the year that cottage food producers in Minnesota get to ship their stuff, at least in Minnesota. We're going to hope for that. Yeah. That would be a step. Wouldn't that be helpful? Wouldn't that be great?
33:35And there's the tightness and the sarcasm bleeding through, I'm sorry.  So anyway, we're at 33 minutes and 15 seconds. Kelsey, thank you for coming back to visit with me and I'm so excited for all the new things you're doing. Well, thank you very much for having me.  Yeah, this was really fun.  Keep  doing the good things for your community because you're really important to the world, Kelsey.  Oh,  thanks.
34:04All right. Have a great day. Yep. You too. Bye. Bye.
 

Cluster Cluck Acres

Today I'm talking with Samantha at Cluster Cluck Acres. You can follow on Facebook as well.
A Tiny Homestead Podcast is sponsored by Homegrowncollective.org.
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00:00You're listening to A Tiny Homestead, the podcast comprised entirely of conversations with homesteaders, cottage food producers, and crafters, and topics adjacent. I'm your host, Mary Lewis.  A Tiny Homestead podcast is sponsored by Homegrown Collective, a free-to-use farm-to-table platform emphasizing local connections with ability to sell online, buy, sell, trade in local garden groups, and help us grow a new food system.  You can find them at homegrowncollective.org. If you're enjoying this podcast, please like, subscribe.
00:29share it with a friend or leave a comment. Thank you. Today I'm talking with Samantha at Cluster Cluck Acres and I had to say that really carefully. Good morning, Samantha. How are you? Good morning. How are you?  I'm good. You are where again? You're in Illinois. Is that right? Nope, Monticello, Indiana. Indiana. Sorry. Yep.  Is it gray in Indiana this morning? Cause it is gray and drizzling here in Minnesota. It definitely is. And it is cold, very cold.
00:56Oh, it's like 45 degrees here this morning. I got up at five and it was warm outside. was like, ooh, spring might be here. I don't call 45 that warm. Well, after the week or so we had back in January when it was minus 20 to 25 at night, I'm good with 45. So tell me about yourself and what you do at Cluster Cluck Acres.
01:25Well,  I am  the owner. So  it's kind of just a basically a family farm. We  started off with chickens  that were actually kind of given to us. We had a friend that had a bunch of chickens and the rooster had attacked one of our kids.  I had wanted some and I grew up with chickens. So I knew.
01:51Um, after I got in the farm that I wanted chickens and then we've moved on to,  I was thinking, oh, they had rabbits also. They wanted to get rid of it. So we took two rabbits in  and then, uh, my oldest son had bought a horse  and we have horse stalls. So he wanted somewhere to bring his horse. So we have a horse.  We have, uh, pigs.  had three, we got down to two and then we just got six more.
02:22Uh, in that chaotic time, we also had a litter of puppies. had 10 golden doodle or 10 doodles. I should say they're a mix of doodles, but they're 10 doodles. So we, we added a little, little more chaos to our, to our lives with puppies.  So yeah, that'll, that'll shake things up a little bit. Just a little. I decided that I will never do a litter again. It's a very emotional process. I didn't realize how emotional it was.
02:54I would have kept all 10 if I could, but...
02:58Yeah, that doesn't usually work. That's a lot of dogs to handle.  And not only that, but you get to deal with littermate syndrome too, which is something I've heard about. Yeah. Well, we thought we were coming, we were getting sick.  So we spent a long night with mom delivering babies. So it was a, it was an all day process, but it was, it was a good experience.
03:23We've had an opportunity to hatch some of our own chickens also. I took the time to get an incubator and so we do some chicken hatching and I just got into doing sourdough. So at the beginning of last week,
03:45Or actually over the weekend, last weekend, we opened a little farm stand out in front of the house. So I have been  creatively working on different items to put out every day to fill the farm stand.  Your  farm stand has inspired me, ma'am.  We have a farm stand. It's a little red shed. It looks like a little tiny barn.
04:12Yes. It's red with white trim. I love it. It's my favorite thing here. We had it put in a few years ago.  And we usually just sell eggs and produce out of there in the summer. And  I saw the way you have yours set up and I was like, I have got to get on baked goods and I've got to get them out there this summer and sell them because why wouldn't I? You know,  we have it. So why not do it?  So you have inspired me to get off my ass and make baked goods this summer.
04:39That's exciting.  I sell sourdough sardar. I have had  what we call Sally now for several months.  I actually did sourdough here at home. then shockingly enough, this is not my only thing that I do. actually a full-time, I have a full-time job. I'm actually an ER nurse.  Wow. So yeah, that's a lot to do on top of what you're doing at home.
05:07And I actually am also currently training, taking fire classes to train to be a firefighter. Oh my God. Wow. Wow. Lady. That's amazing. Yeah. I've been an ER nurse for 10 years and I took EMT classes last year so that I can kind of cross over to the 911 aspect of emergency medicine.
05:32And in order to do that in our local town here in Monticello, you also have to be a fire certified. So I  am getting fire certified now. do  you actually want to be like a volunteer firefighter or it's just because you have to do this? You know, honestly, going into it, I wasn't really for sure how I felt about it, but as we're going through the scenarios and learning the skills,  I think it would.
05:59It would be challenging, but it might be something I would enjoy. Okay. I was just curious.  Um, okay. So let's go back to the sourdough thing just for a minute, only because it's a very homesteadish thing to do.  and I don't, I haven't done it yet. I keep saying I need to, and I keep not doing it and I got to get on that. But  when you started doing it, were you like, I don't know if this is going to work.
06:27when you put, when you got the starter started or did you get some from someone? So I, I started my own initially and I have very minimal patience for tedious things. So it takes, it takes seven to 14 days in order to get that, to actually ferment like it's supposed to be. So  I, once I didn't have a lot of progress within a few days, I kind of started over again a couple of times to be exact.
06:57And then I have a really good friend that I worked with at the hospital who did sourdough. And so she gave me a portion of her starter and I've kind of just grown it from there.  Yeah. See that's, I think that's why I keep putting it off. Cause I'm like, with my luck, it won't even do what it's supposed to do. But I think I know somebody who has some, so maybe I will just be smart and get some from her. Maybe honestly you're supposed to waste it every day. So waste the waste that someone gets rid of every day is what you
07:27what people can give as a starter. Yeah. Yep. I'm gonna,  I'm going to go make sure she's doing it and be like, can I get some of your discard? Cause I really don't want to screw around with trying to start it. Cause I will be so sad when it doesn't work.  It is.  well, and I, so honestly, when I started, I, I really thought I had the groove of sourdough. It's, it's definitely an art.  And then for my birthday this year, I got a  sourdough book.
07:56that is extremely,  it's extremely intense on making sourdough and it has changed how I felt about my first loaves of bread.
08:09So it's kind of exciting to see where I where they were in the beginning and then where they are now is there's a there's a big difference Well, yes, because it's a learning process and  I'm  I'm gonna say this again I'm a mom so I I love telling people I'm proud of them because I have four kids I spend a lot of time telling my kids I was proud of them  But I'm so proud of you and everyone else who starts something like sourdough  because you're right in the beginning it's
08:38It's bread like when you take the loaf out. You're like, okay. Yeah, that's bread But as you keep going there's so much you can do with it. So stick with it. I'm proud of you  and The other thing that I want to say is it's not just sourdough breads. My husband is  the yeast bread maker in our house He does it really well. I don't need to put my hands in in the mix  and He used to make these  Italian herbed breads
09:05So like the Italian herbs dried that you get at the store. Yes. He would put that in the dough and  they were good. They were bread-like. They were fine. They were edible. I liked them. And he made two loaves, three loaves, two loaves and four little, um, like hamburger bun sized circles  two weekends ago. And he did it when I was headed to bed. decided that he got a
09:31wild hare and decided he wanted me breath. And I got up in the morning and I am not kidding, there were two just  gorgeous, perfect bread loaf, bread loaves sitting on the island in bread bags with the bread ties looking beautiful. I said, how did you get them to look like actual  loaves of bread? He says,
09:55I just keep getting better every time I do it. And he was just smiling huge. And I think that's exactly how you're feeling about yours. You're learning, you're getting better. Yes. And my favorite part is to,  once they're all cooled off and ready to put them in a bag and then stick our little sticker on it. And it just, it, it's so satisfying. It's, it's the beauty. It's all in the art.  Yes. And isn't it fun when you have your stickers? Like  when I made the labels for my granola,
10:25I, the first bag of granola that I put a label on and it said a tiny homestead and the ingredients and the,  the cottage food registration number and our name.  was like,  I freaking love this. This is so great.  is. It's, it's so pretty.  I, I went from the, I have a fancy label that I had made initially, which has the cute little chicken and the little like wheat flowers on each side of it and says our name and stuff. But then I decided with our name, you know,
10:54cluster clock acres that we  maybe couldn't go quite so formal. It seemed a little out of space, out of place to be the name with formal. So I actually drew  what our logo is now and then what I want to use for our  egg cartons as well as like all of our breads and stuff.  Yep. Yeah.  We...
11:21When I saw the name of your place, I was like, have to be really careful when I introduced this because I want to make sure that my enunciation is  perfect.  Because I call our chickens the little cluckers all the time.  And I said it one time and it was very,  I don't know what I was doing, but it did not sound like cluckers enough that people wouldn't mistake it for the other word.
11:47I never used the F word on the podcast. have done over 250 episodes and not  once has the F word left my lips because I won't do it. Yeah. And I swear like a pirate in real life. Like I love that word so much because you can say it in so many ways,  so many inflections. It means all the things. And I said to my husband, I said, I have got
12:11to not ever say that word on the podcast when I started this. And he's like, good luck with that. It's your favorite word. so, um, yeah, I, I love that your place is, is called what it's called because it's so funny. And there, don't think there's a chicken owner alive who hasn't called their chickens cluckers. I, when I had, so I had the signs made for our roadside stand to stick out, um, by the road.
12:42And when I called the guy to make the signs, he said, excuse me, you want what on your sign? And I said, I said it again and he was like on a sign and he clearly thought I kept saying the other word.  it was quite, it was quite funny. I still don't think that he  necessarily believed me when I first called that it was an actual business because he very questionably, we hung up, said,
13:12Well, send me your email or  tell me what email is. And I told him cluster clock acres. Yeah. And he was like, okay.  And then the conversation was over and I said, I'm not for sure this guy believes that I really exist.  I think he thinks somebody's playing a break on him. Yeah.  It wouldn't surprise me because  most people don't get farm humor unless they're farmers. So, right.
13:38I was also gonna tell you there's a place in Minnesota called Locally Laid Egg Company and someone that I know is, she and her husband are the owners,  and  they actually sell in stores in Minnesota now. They're eggs.  And their whole shtick  is all the jokes around locally laid  eggs.  Like locally laid chicks are better, ha ha ha. That whole thing.
14:07And every time they come up with something new and I see it, I just giggle like I'm five years old.  And  it's so fun when you can add  real silly humor into your business because you know, and I know that when you're trying to run a business,  it can be really stressful.  so  when there's some levity and you think of a new thing, that's funny that you can add into your marketing, it takes some of that pressure away.
14:34Well, I don't know if you zoomed in on my stand at all when you looked at the pictures. No, I did not. So in the in the right hand corner, I made a sign which I thought about for a really long time because I needed to incorporate chickens in it. it says self serve. Don't be a pecker. Yes, I did see that. Yes, I laughed. Yes. And that's what I laughed hysterically. And my little girl who's 12 was like, what are you laughing at?
15:04And I would tell her and she was like, oh, you're so annoying. Because chicken jokes are one of my favorite. So she hears them often. It's like dad jokes, only it's chicken jokes. Yes. I think most people that I'm close to usually, usually wind up with a chicken joker too a day. Yeah. My husband is so big into dad jokes. It's his default.
15:32I'm not as amused by them, I've heard them all. And my son, who still lives with us, he's the youngest of four, he's 23, he thinks that dad jokes are funny to this day. And my husband will come up with a fairly new one that the kid hasn't heard before. And there's a specific laugh that he does when his dad does the dad joke. And I'm like, he must have just told another dad joke. And I won't even have heard it, you know? So it's fun.
16:01Okay, so what else do you sell in your farm stand besides your sourdough bread?  So far I have put out pretzel bites.  Ooh yum.
16:16cinnamon rolls,  scones, bagels.
16:23I had some of our stickers made that you can put on like a water bottle or whatever. The sourdough starter.
16:35I haven't, and then the eggs, obviously, I haven't incorporated a whole lot into it yet. Our sand is only like 32 by 32 because I have a fear of everything in life when it comes to failure. So I told myself if this was going to fail, I wasn't going to invest a large amount of money in it. So I actually, my mom lives not too far from me and is the collector of all things in life. And she has some old barns and stuff. And so I went out there and found most of what my farm sand is made of.
17:06So my boyfriend wanted to expand much larger to begin with, but I couldn't commit to large. So we stick with what we are now. So I don't have a lot of room to put stuff, but I learned very quickly that this, will outgrow this by the summer. Okay. I think it's really cute and cozy, but if you're going to run a room, definitely you're to need to make it bigger. Well, we live, so I like,
17:36I live in a very traffic like on a corner that's got a lot of traffic. And I don't know if you know what Indiana Beach is or have heard of Indiana Beach. So it's a little amusement park here in the town that we live in. And it gets pretty busy in the summertime. And we're pretty close to the lake where our house is now. And so there's a lot of people that come up and visit and stuff for the summer.
18:04So I  think this summer it's gonna be pretty busy. And then of course we're  doing a huge garden. So we'll have some produce out there too. So I'll need some more space for those kinds of items. Yeah, I think you're probably gonna be more successful than you know. I really do. Okay, so you have a garden. What do you grow?  So this, I've actually only been at this house for, June will be a year. So this is my first year of actually,
18:33having a big garden.  so far we have started tomatoes, potatoes, carrots, peppers,  zucchini, lettuce, beans.
18:50jalapenos,  squash, melons,  and
19:04Um, I'm sure they get that sit.
19:08That might be it so far. So when you say started, do you mean outside or do you mean inside? Inside. We have lots of plants inside. Yeah, because mean, Indiana is further south than I am, but I can't imagine that it's time yet to be putting seedlings in the ground or seeds in the ground yet for you. No, no, no, no, no, No, they're inside.  We have them, you know, all the girl lights on them and do the wind  with the fan.
19:36every day for a couple hours so that they grow their strength. we started, I started tomato plants back in  the end of February, beginning of March. So we've got some pretty big sized ones and then we just started some more. I will have probably close to 200 when we get done. Nice.  Nice.  You started yours about the time my husband started hours on our kitchen table with grow lights. Yep. And
20:06My whole kitchen table right now is basil seedlings and some of them are maybe an inch tall because they're in the little cells and they're stunted and we need to get them transplanted soon. But some of them are in actual five inch pots and those we could actually pull a couple leaves off of each one and have enough to have a batch of bruschetta. Oh wow. So yeah, love, I love, love, love this time of year April.
20:33April may be my favorite spring month because we've already got stuff started and we're getting close to being able to put stuff in on May 15th. So our greenhouse is packed full of baby plants right now. To the point that my husband said, I can't do any more until we get some of this moved to the high tunnel for sale.  I was like, that's fine. He said, I'm, said every night I'm going to be out there watering. He said, cause I want these things to grow. And I said, yeah, no,  I get it.
21:03And the high tunnel is set up. It  just needs plastic on it this weekend to get that ready to go.
21:15Yeah, we, I just had all of mine inside so far. I think I will probably wind up investing in a greenhouse, but I like to start small, see where things go and then grow from there. I can't just jump into everything because it, everything is scary for failure. So, I'm kind of like you. call it hedging my bets. Yeah. Well, I do. I even went as cheap as my plastic for around the plants on my metal
21:45shelving the metal shelf that you put in a garage  is like a $1.89 painter's tarp. That's okay.  And I was like, we're going to make this super cheap.  Part of all of this is being resourceful. Yes.  That's one of things that I love about homesteaders and farmers and people who are getting into this  because  the bottom of our
22:13wood shed and you will laugh when I explain this I haven't told anybody this story yet  my husband put  um pallet walls along the sides and Embrace them so pallets that you get for free wherever people are giving away wooden pallets That's the walls and then he put um cattle panels arched over the top of those and then he put  a tarp over that Tied it down and I swear to you it looks like he built an ark
22:43for our woodshed. That's awesome.  It didn't cost us anything because we had all the stuff to do it.  people pull in and they're like, what is that? Because they're just glancing. And my husband says, that's our woodshed. And they're like, it looks like a boat.  every time they say it, I'm just dying inside. Because that's what I said. I said, it looks like you built an ark to protect the wood.
23:11when you can be resourceful and when you can find stuff for free or inexpensively. I think that's brilliant. So  that's not if you're a failure, that's hope for success. Yes. How's that? I flipped that on. did nice. You did. You did.  It's a whole different way of looking at it.  Exactly. And I don't think anyone should like go broke  to pursue their dreams. You know, that doesn't...
23:40That's not the point.  but anyway, let me think. What else can I tell you? Or you can tell me both probably.  This is the first year that we will be selling bedding plants. And that's why our greenhouse is so full because we want people to be able to buy stuff so they can start their own backyard gardens. Cause right now anyone in America would be smart to have a small background backyard garden.
24:09Yes. Well, and I actually looked at plants at, uh, I think it was Meyer the other day and the tomato plants were like $5. So that's why we, we got some more going cause we kind of had the same idea that if we were able to offer some for a little bit cheaper and people were able to start gardens for cheaper than what it is to buy it from the store, then it would be, I,
24:37I'm lucky  in this part or this aspect of it because this isn't my full-time job. It is my full-time job, but it's not my full-time job, if that makes sense. And so I don't  have to be at the top in order to be successful. I can be at the bottom  and  help people who can't afford the top. Right. Yep, exactly.
25:05With everything being so chaotic right now, anyone who can do it needs to be growing something because  I am,  oh man,  I was doing something on my phone for the podcast yesterday, looked up at the screen on TV, because I keep the news on because our dog doesn't like the house quiet. We've always had  noise since we got her since she was a puppy.  And so if it's very quiet, she gets all.
25:31anxious and she barks at everything because she hears everything and thinks it's something bad.  And looked up at the screen and it said that  President Trump had decided to do a 90 day stay on the terror stuff. And I don't know all the details, but either way.  And my first thought was, are you kidding me? We could have avoided everything over last two days if you'd just done this in the first place. And I don't want to get into politics. I mean, it could have been any president doing this, but
26:00The up and down chaos right now  is  really, really hard. And if you can just take control of your own situation in your own place and grow food you can eat or make bread, make bread like Samantha and my husband do,  at least you feel like you have a little bit of control to curb some of the anxiety that the circumstances outside of your control are causing.  Yes. Well, that was a lot of words. Sorry about that.
26:29Um,  so yeah,  uh, what else we've got like four more minutes. have no idea what you're talking about, but you know why? Because I zero outside contact with I don't watch news. I actually didn't have social media. I had it for a long period of time and then I,  uh, I deleted it for about seven years only because I just, the,  just had to get
26:56out of that world and then I just got it back in order to have the business pays on on Facebook and stuff. And so I am usually oblivious to anything that is going on inside the world or out, you know, around the world,  mainly because I try to focus on what's here and now. And  I think my little girl comes home from school and tells me more,  more world things that are going on than I, you know, know, or
27:24somebody will mention something at work and I'm like, what are you talking about?  Yeah, I got hooked on being a news hound back during COVID because my husband  worked for a big corporate company and he was outsourced to work on  the printers and fax machines at hospitals and clinics.  And  I really felt like I needed to know what was going on with
27:49the news about COVID because he was literally exposed every day.  And it made me so nervous. Like I love him so much. And I was just like, please don't let him catch something that's going to kill him.  And so I just, got used to flipping the news on in the morning, local news on in the morning and then  national news during the day, partly to keep my ear to the ground.
28:17and partly because the dog needed noise and there was nothing else that I really needed to have on. So I became a news addict and now I have it on, but I'm not listening to it. I'm actually listening to podcasts about doing podcasts because that's my new thing.  Or I'm listening to the recordings that I've done with you guys  or I'm editing or whatever.  So.
28:42I happen to look up, catch the little ticker tape at the bottom and be like, what now? You know? Yeah. No, no, I get it. I get it. Like I said, sometimes it works. They'll be talking about stuff, but unfortunately I lived COVID. So  that was, uh, that was not news that I wanted to see when I came home and I,  I actually lost my dad to COVID. So it was not a,  uh,  not a wonderful time. No, no.  And
29:08You're probably the last person I should say this to because I've said it on the podcast before. COVID was  really,  really terrible for a lot of people and you're one of them.  COVID also woke us up a little bit. And I think it  kind of drove some of this people moving out of the cities and pursuing the homesteading stuff.  So I think it's one of those double edged sword things where people lost people they love and I'm so sorry for that. And it's tragic.
29:38but I also feel like we needed some kind of wake up call to get our heads out of our asses regarding how we live. So I'm really sorry that your dad  was taken from you. That's terrible. There are a lot of people that lost family members, but I was, we were fortunate that we were at a time where we were able to visit the hospital and of course I worked there. So yeah, good. It, I, the crazy story I watched them.
30:04movie, I think it's Contagion or Contingent or something like that. Contagion maybe? Is that what it is?  Right before COVID. Yeah.  And it was, it was just crazy that we were living  that, that whole movie.  It was insane. Yeah. And it's, I'm glad you said that because I think it's
30:33It's weird that humans like dream up all these things that might happen or could happen and they write books about it or they produce movies about it. My boys, I have a daughter and then three sons and the boys were always coming up with who's your team if there's a zombie apocalypse and who would you need on your team? Like would you need someone who could cook? Would you need someone who could kill animals? Would you need someone who could butcher? Da da da. And I'm like, guys,
31:01You don't really want to think about this because God forbid that ever happens.  Right. And there are so many zombie movies and they loved them. My kids are grown. The youngest still lives with us. He's 23. The other three are out of the house. Obviously they're, they're grown adults, but,  I haven't seen a zombie based movie in forever and I really don't care if I ever see one again. Yeah, let's not live that. Let's not do that. Yeah, no, I'm good. I watched,  I watched,
31:32God, I can't remember the names of them, but  all the zombie things that came out in the late 90s, early  2000s, and then the  2010s. And I really haven't seen anything in the last eight years. And I'm so glad I haven't because I'm good on zombie  We don't need it. No, I really don't.  It was fun. It was fun. The boys thought it was fun.  you know, when you're a mom, you want to have your kids be happy.
32:01And I didn't see anything wrong with them having a plan, but I'm like, you're planning for the wrong thing, guys. Right, right. So, all right. So it's been 31 minutes and 45 seconds now, and I try to keep these to half an hour. So Samantha, thank you for sharing with me today. That was awesome. Yeah, thank you. Thank you for your time. Yeah. Have a great day. You too. All right, bye. Bye.
 

Authentic Food

Today I'm talking with Janna at Authentic Food. You can follow on Instagram as well.
A Tiny Homestead Podcast is sponsored by Homegrowncollective.org.
If you'd like to support me in growing this podcast, like, share, subscribe or leave a comment. Or just buy me a coffee 
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00:00You're listening to A Tiny Homestead, the podcast comprised entirely of conversations with homesteaders, cottage food producers, and crafters, and topics adjacent. I'm your host, Mary Lewis.  A Tiny Homestead podcast is sponsored by Homegrown Collective, a free-to-use farm-to-table platform emphasizing local connections with ability to sell online, buy, sell, trade in local garden groups, and help us grow a new food system.  You can find them at homegrowncollective.org. If you're enjoying this podcast, please like, subscribe.
00:29Share it with a friend or leave a comment. Thank you. Today I'm talking with Janna at Authentic Food. Good afternoon, Janna. How are you? I'm phenomenal. How are you doing, Mary?  I'm fantastic. I love the word phenomenal.  I love it. No one ever uses it. Thank you for using that word.  Where are you? Where are you located?  Actually, right now I am in Miami, Florida,  but I'm rarely here because I'm always traveling. I'm usually in and out for a day or two and then  on the road.
00:59Oh, okay. Is  Miami nice today? Yes, of course. It's beautiful. It's sunny and warm  and yeah, we're going into full on summer here. Yeah, we are, we are wintery today in Minnesota, but starting tomorrow, it's supposed to start warming up and stay warming up. So I'm very excited for this. Oh, good. Good, good, good. And my daughter actually lives in St. Petersburg, Florida. So.
01:28Oh, lovely. So hopefully get to visit during those  cold months. Not yet, but it's sort of been it's been floated. We haven't decided yet when we're going to go. So.  All right. OK, so tell me about yourself and authentic food.  So authentic food dot com has been brewing for about a decade.  It has lived inside me and it's finally the.
01:57It's such a good feeling to get it out.  So I was traveling for work  all over the world  and sometimes I would be in a country for maybe a day or two.  And I've always loved food. I'm also an Italian citizen. So, you know, for me, food is kind of religion. And  I would always want to have some kind of dish that I could only get in a certain place.  And
02:26Like even if I was in Denver, I'd want a Denver omelet or I was in Australia. I wanted to try kangaroo, something that was very like regionally specific or culturally specific.  And I kept, when I would be in a country, I would ask people, what, what's the most authentic dish here? Or I can't get anywhere else. And,  um, the conversations were just really fascinating to me. And it was like, I couldn't get a straight answer. And then some people would send me places and I would feel like.
02:55Oh, I could have gotten this, you know, in Florida.  And so  then I would start asking  the concierge at the hotel, if they would eat there, they would send me to these places and, and they would say, well, no, I don't really eat there. And I'm like, well, where would you eat?  And then I got even more intuitive and I would ask them, well, would your mom eat there?  And it was like the deeper I was getting in the conversation.
03:23the more authenticity I felt like I was getting for that kind of local flavor.  And I  really started to wonder how are people coming up with this idea of authenticity surrounding food and restaurants? And so much so that  I went back to college and I got a PhD so that I could research it. I did a five-year PhD at University of Florida.
03:48What was the PhD in? was the sociology? So I did the sociology  of food and specifically how society creates the idea of authenticity in regard to  Super cool. Yeah. I, yeah,  I mean, starting a PhD in my forties, everyone thought I was nuts.  Um,  but here I am. I graduated almost a year ago now  and
04:18During that time,  I  hadn't been in academia in a while. So I realized that a lot of the stuff that I was writing was sitting behind these paywalls and these  academic journals. And I wanted people to have access to the discussions that I was having, the interviews I was doing. so  I at some point bought authenticfood.com domain and it sat. And then last fall, this past November,
04:45My daughters are like, mom, you need to do something with appendixv.com. And I thought that it would be a little blog that maybe I did once a month or something, but it has really grown into something more. And I love these dialogues with people about authenticity because as a sociologist, I study how society creates this narrative.
05:12And for me, I learned that it was through a very like socially constructed idea as an individual. So food is very universal, but we each have these very personal experiences with food.  And it was driving me crazy because I would see like chefs or writers write these articles saying, oh, authenticity doesn't exist. Well, after studying it for almost a decade and getting a PhD in it, I'm here to say it does.
05:43Yeah,  I would say you are the person to know that answer.  I did not go to college.  I could not face the idea of sitting in a room  for hours at a time listening to someone lecture. I was a really good student in high school, but I knew that I didn't have what it took to sit in a big room listening to someone lecture, so I did not do that.
06:08And so I don't know much about the structure of college education. PhD is the one where you have to do a thesis, is that right?  It depends on the PhD program. For my program, it's a five-year program with a master's built into it. So you have to get a master's and do a master's thesis. And then after that, you spend the next three years  doing your dissertation work, all your research.
06:36For me, I'm a qualitative researcher, so everything that I do  is a narrative. I  obviously enumerate, I don't do anything that's numerical where I gather data, but I did all interviews.  And so then the next three years I spent interviewing  and  researching,  and then I wrote my dissertation, which is I think a little over 200 pages. And  which is interesting because I'm not a writer.
07:04You are now, honey.  Well, it seems that I am. And like I said, the authenticfood.com has kind of evolved and we've ended up hiring writers, we've hired photographers, we've done some amazing interviews.  I can't believe how much  interest it's received and I feel really lucky because  maybe you've experienced this, but even when you're passionate about something or you feel strongly about something,
07:33That doesn't mean everyone else is going to, right? So putting it out there, you know, and being vulnerable and saying, hey, this is where I'm at and then have people meet me there was, it was very humbling and  I'm  very, very thankful. So  I do relate when I started this podcast, which is my thing, my passion, my thing.  I really didn't think that it would do anything. I didn't think anyone would want to talk to me. I thought they would think that I was asking weird questions and it would just die.
08:03And I've been doing it for a little over a year and a half now and I love it. And I fall in love with every person that comes and talks to me because they're so  gracious and helpful and kind and they were willing to come talk to me, you know? Yeah, definitely. mean, definitely when you give someone your time, it's just the best gift ever. And  I really appreciate you  having me on today. It's so fun, Jana.
08:29I mean, you know, you do interviews. You know how much fun it is to ask a question and get an answer you didn't expect  or a vulnerable story that you didn't know you were gonna hear.  It just changes something in the way your brain works, I think. Definitely. I live for the interview. I live for the interview. The writing, the other stuff, I'm like,  eh.  Yeah.  Okay. So what I want to add to your story about food authenticity.
08:59is I grew up on the East Coast. I grew up in the state of Maine  and I moved to Minnesota when I was like 22 years old, I think. I'm 55 now.  And I don't know if you've ever been to Maine, but you are in Florida. You're East Coast, but you're Southern East Coast. And so you have access to seafood, I would guess, just like I did growing up. Yes. Yes. Yes, of course. Yes.  It's really hard to move from a state where you can have
09:29really good off the boat seafood to a state where you don't trust buying seafood because  it may kill you, number one, because it may not be good because people don't know how to take care of seafood.  And number two, it's never going to be the same because it's not a day  old. It wasn't caught yesterday, if that makes sense. So when I moved here,
09:55I learned about Minnesota food and I'm trying really hard not to be a snot about this because I love Minnesota. I've been here a long time.  But I tried  wild rice soup at a restaurant like a year after I moved here.  I'd never had it before. It's not something we ate in Maine.  And it was fantastic and I learned how to make it.
10:22And I finally got at the point where I feel like I can serve it to diet in the wool, born and bred Minnesotans. And they think that I make it really well. Oh, that's lovely. I love that.  So  my concept of authentic food is something that is common to the region that you're in,  people grow up eating, that grandma or great grandma made, if that makes sense.
10:48Yeah, definitely. And I think a lot of people go to that place when I interview them and we talk about what authentic food means to them. A lot of people go to that regionality. They go to these geographic locations. I mean, that's not unusual. And for you, it sounds like your experiences  near the water and having access to fresh seafood. And it's funny you say that because my youngest daughter moved to Denver.
11:17And she was born in Florida and grew up in Florida. And she was like, Mom,  I don't eat any seafood out here. So when she comes home, she wants shrimp and all those same things. So it's fascinating that you're saying this, but  it's interesting too how we kind of just take that for granted. Right?  We don't think about what we have access to until it's gone.
11:45We also give a lot of power to restaurant to determine who,  how we're going to understand authenticity too. Right? Like you walk into a restaurant that says authentic Maine lobster in, I  don't know, Idaho. Right. And you just think, well, if you've never been to Maine and you have a lobster there, you think this is what fresh lobsters like. No.
12:12So  I think the idea of authenticity  and  how that gets transformed into our food systems  and our food ways is, it's very personal, I think for everyone. I think that's why too, I want an authentic food.com to be a platform for people to tell their stories at that very individual level.  And I love that you have
12:41made this dish your own and now you feel like you can make it and people will feel like they're having this authentic experience in Minnesota. even though I had never even heard of chicken wild rice soup until I was 23 years old. Right. Yeah. And I don't know if you've ever had it, but it's a very creamy, hearty dish for like January when it's minus 20 outside. Oh, no, it sounds amazing.
13:09I'd love to talk to you more about it, honestly, because I don't think we've done any recipes that are specific to Minnesota, so this is really fascinating. I I've never been there.  Oh, well, number one, don't ever call a casserole a casserole in Minnesota because it is not called a casserole. It's called a hot dish. A hot dish. Okay, this is good. Yeah, I kept saying casserole because back home, it's casserole.
13:35And people were like, it's not a casserole, it's a hot dish. And I'm like, oh my God, it's food in a dish. Eat it. Don't  talk to me about what it's called.  And then I started to realize that every region has its nickname for the food.  very  true.  And there's this  thing, and I can't think of the name of it right now, but basically it's a pickled fish  that you can eat. I can't think of name of it.
14:04Of course I can't because I can't stand it. I don't ever want to try it. I've smelled it. I don't want to eat it.  And it's a thing in Minnesota and you either love it or you hate it.  What else is in Minnesota that I didn't know about?
14:21I don't know, there's like three or four very specific things and I've mentioned three, think,  but I do know that when I go home to visit my parents in Maine, the first thing I want to eat as a lunch or a dinner is a lobster roll because  I can't get one here that is actually what I know to be a lobster roll.  And the other thing that I could not get here for a long time was a whoopie pie.
14:50And I don't know if you know what a whoopie pie is. It's a very cakey. I I do because my mother is from Pennsylvania. Yeah. It's a very cakey cookie. And you have two cookies and in between the two cookies sandwiched in between is like this buttercream, marshmallow-y frosting kind of thing. And they are delicious and they have this mouth feel that is like heaven. And I really missed whoopie pies. And then about 20 years ago,
15:19I discovered a place down the road from us. It  was an apple barn to start with. They had an orchard and they sold apples, but then they expanded it and they have candy and stuff. They sell puzzles. They have more puzzles in one place than I've ever seen. They had whoopie pies in their cooler.  I looked at the wrapper and it was from the place that makes them in Maine that I had grown up getting them from.
15:47I almost dropped to my knees and thank God for the whoopie pie I bought from them.  So it's little things like that too that are  your food identity, think.  Yeah, definitely.  I think a lot of people  identify with the idea of authenticity because they do feel, and I think you mentioned earlier in the conversation about those traditions.
16:17Yeah.  And so tradition, that word tradition gets brought up a lot when I'm interviewing people about authentic food  and how we understand what traditions are. There is some parallel there.  But yeah, we have these very  traditional ideas and pass down generational  recipes. And  the biggest thing I've found about authentic food
16:46that the majority of people say is there's always some kind of experience that goes along with it, right? Like they'll talk about my grandmother in the kitchen  making, you know,  X  or my dad on the grill  or my aunt's,  you know, snapping peas in the kitchen, you know, these, experiences or,  you know,  um,  especially over holidays  or
17:15Just time together, which  is a very interesting  concept in the relationship to  authenticity.  I mean, without getting too detailed into my research and being too boring with all my sociological jargon.  can, you can, can step in there. It's okay. Yeah. Um,  we,  when I was doing a research for my master's work, I actually did,  um,
17:44a study in Istanbul, Turkey. And I interviewed a bunch of restaurant owners and it's a type of restaurant that has existed since the Byzantine era. So this type of restaurant has existed all through the Ottoman Empire and these types of restaurants still exist in Istanbul today. But what's so fascinating about it was people still get so uptight about
18:12different ones being authentic or not.  And I think that's why I wanted to study it because this restaurant started as a men's only restaurant  in the Byzantine era. And now in modern Istanbul, women own these types of restaurants. So  I was trying to figure out how are they still seeing authenticity in the restaurant if it has evolved so much.  And the one thing that I found from my research was that
18:41When I talked to the restaurant owners, they kept  bringing up these ideas that are part of this idea of third place.  And I don't know if you are familiar with this, but  the sociologists had come up with this idea that  we gravitate to these spaces that aren't our home, they aren't our work, but it's like a third place, right? So like,  would say, and I hope this doesn't date me too much, the...
19:10The idea I think of is like  the show Cheers. When,  yeah, you know,  the people would walk in and like the one guy would walk in and everyone would say his name  and you know, it just felt familiar.  And that was the kind of space that they felt was creating authenticity  and that relationship between creating this space and
19:39Authenticity was really fascinating. I don't think anyone at that point had really connected that dot in my field.  And so that was, I was really excited to find that. And then it kind of crossed over into other things I noticed too. And  I do know Starbucks kind of uses that model of third place, right? When you go in, they want to put your name on the cup. They want you to have this familiarity.  I think their business model has evolved.
20:07a bit since it first opened.  yeah,  I,  learning all these ways that society was creating this narrative authenticity was just fascinating to me. And I don't think that it's just this very static dichotomous, yes, this is authentic or no, this isn't authentic. I think you really have to approach authenticity in food or food ways as a fluid concept.
20:33and look how it's evolving and changing as society changes. Yeah, I feel like it's like the saying about beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I think authenticity is in the eye of the beholder too. Oh, I totally agree with that. Definitely. Definitely. You said Starbucks, which leads me to Caribou because I like both. I don't care. I like somebody who's going to feed me sugar in a cup. I'm good with that.
21:00It's so funny, we got a dog when we moved to our place four and a half years ago, a puppy. And she does not like people. Like she loves us, she loves her pack, but she's really barky around strangers. So if we take her in the vehicle with us anywhere and we pull through a drive-through for say a mocha from Starbucks or Caribou, she just barks because she can see the people in the window and she doesn't know them, so they're strangers.
21:27And I was so excited to get a puppy because I was like, oh, we can get her a pup cup when we occasionally stop for coffee or they'll give her a treat or whatever.  No, she wants nothing to do with those things. And I was like, well, I guess that marketing tactic was lost on my dog. Yeah.  Sounds like  it. Yeah. So it's really funny how  restaurants, and I don't mean mom and pop,  authentic, you know.
21:55Like not Olive Garden, but a real Italian restaurant. All the chain places tend to do all these little gimmicky things to get you to come back because it feels like they know you, but they don't know you. Whereas if you go to the same mom and pop restaurant that is not a chain over the years, at least four or five times a year, you know.
22:20the owners probably know you, they probably recognize you when you walk in and they probably know your favorite food.  And I feel like there's real authenticity there because you are creating a relationship with the business owner. This is very true. Like I said earlier, you know, a lot of times when I talk to people about authenticity, there is that experience built into it.
22:44And within that experience, you're right. There is a relationship that builds.  yeah, I mean, that cannot be duplicated. And whether it's your, you know, not even talking about food, but your own authenticity or your own authentic self, once you bring that to food, that's going to play out in the relationship. So I totally agree with what you're saying.
23:11Like I said, I'm obsessed with this idea and so fascinated with these conversations. Yeah, everything that you are saying in response to what I'm saying just proves that I haven't been crazy all these years about what food does for people.  I was kind of obsessed with why everyone is so focused on food at get togethers because
23:36When I would want to get together with a friend, I would want to just get a coffee or a tea and just talk. lots of people want to have a meal and talk.  And I'm not, that's not my thing.  And I didn't understand it. And then  we had people over for dinner a couple of times when we first moved here, because we actually have a kitchen where we can sit in the kitchen at a kitchen table and have dinner across from each other.  And
24:05I went all out because I had a big pretty kitchen to cook in and I love to cook and I was like, I am going to make the best things ever in this kitchen. And we had friends over and we sat down to eat and we had really nice conversation. had really good food and there is nothing like being complimented on the food that you cooked for anyone who doesn't cook. Learn to cook. It's worth it just for the compliments. And I really, for the first time,
24:33understood why food is a bonding agent, because I really felt like good things happened over that meal in the conversation. Yeah, definitely. I mean, I think it's been, you know, proven that food is a great equalizer.  And it really transcends those social boundaries, right? Like, maybe we don't have the same culture, the same beliefs, the same religion, but we all have to eat.  Yeah.
25:03Right. We cannot survive without food and water. All the other things are peripheral.  And so  it really has become an equalizer. And once you bring that authenticity into it,  it just makes that connection so much deeper. And  we're at like 20, almost 25 minutes. I don't want to take up too much of your time, but I have a question.  When I saw the name of
25:32of your website,  I wasn't sure that you were talking about authentic in the way that you have been talking about it  or in the way of how people say whole foods,  produce from the garden or  beef that you met the cow and you know the butcher and it comes home wrapped and goes in your freezer. And to me, that's how I perceived authentic food when I saw the name.
25:59This that you're talking about is so much more interesting than how I was perceiving the name.  Oh, well, good. I'm glad because I think, mean,  of course, using something as  prolific as authentic because it has been out there. And like I said, there are many pieces written about authenticity and  how it doesn't really exist and all that.  I think I really just wanted to
26:27look at it from a different lens, a sociological lens, of course.  hopefully people that will translate as we  grow  and the dialogues become  more and more  and we  basically accumulate more and more amazing stories. Yeah.  how much time you got, Jana? Because I got 10 more minutes.
26:55No, I'm fine until I have  a meeting at three, so I'm good. Okay, cool.  So this is going to sound really dumb because I don't quite know how all of this works with getting a master's in something. But  what is the point of what you're doing? Are you trying to  teach people about  authenticity in food?  What is your end game with this?
27:24I don't know that I have a specific end game. think for me,  know, every day, whether you realize it or not,  you are interacting with something that probably says authentic on it regarding food.  If you go to the grocery store,  you can see a label that'll say authentic and pick it up and you don't even realize that you're engaging with it. I mean, there's  one spring water bottle,  I think,
27:54comes in a green bottle and it says authentic on it. Yeah. And then how many times do you walk into a restaurant  and authentic is on the outside of the restaurant or on their website  or  maybe the reviews  on, you know, Yelp or Google, someone says, don't go to this restaurant. It's not authentic.  I think for me, I want people to question that.
28:22Right? We don't just have to just assume that someone else has this power of deciding what is authentic or what isn't authentic.  And we really need to  think about  what, how we interact with food and why it matters. Right? I mean, especially in a time when we see our food systems just going through a lot of changes and the quality of our food  deteriorating.
28:51Um, I think it's important to have this dialogue about what authentic food looks like and how we're creating it and who we are giving power to create it. And I think that's that ultimately was why I wanted to be able to tell these stories. And I mean, we tell all kinds of stories, um, from Michelin star restaurants to, you know, somebody selling boiled peanuts on the side of the road that no one's ever heard of, you know? Yeah. Um,
29:21So I think I wanted to preserve some of these very rich stories that I feel like are kind of  going away. And I don't know there's an end game.  I don't know. We do have a mini documentary series coming out as well. So  I'm really excited about that. yeah.
29:46I don't know. It's just something I've been very passionate about for a very long time.  And it's just nice to  get it out. Okay.  And I wasn't implying there had to be an end game. I was just trying to figure out how this all falls together.  The other thing that I find interesting is people are always, you said Michelin star rated  restaurants.  People are always like, oh my God, they're a five star Michelin restaurant. We have to go there.
30:17Um, let me tell you a story. I went to a very, very fancy restaurant in Minneapolis back when I was divorced and starting to date again. And it was a very pretty restaurant. Like I walked in and I was just blown away to how beautiful it was visually. the food was okay. It wasn't anything to write home about. And I love food. I am not, I'm not weird about food.
30:44the best thing that they made there was stuffed mushrooms.  The whole menu, I love these stuffed mushrooms.  And I had to learn how to replicate it. So I looked up a stuffed mushroom recipe and  I knew what was in the  dish I had ordered.  And I looked up the recipe, I was like, I can do that. And I made it and it was basically the same only better because I put the things I like in it.
31:10So just because you're a Michelin star rated restaurant, it doesn't necessarily mean that you are perfection on a plate. It means that the people who decide those things decided that they liked it. Oh yeah, definitely. Definitely. I mean, and I think that kind of goes back to how we give power to people and what, you know, what decides  what's  a Michelin  star restaurant or what's authentic or, you know,
31:40Um, I mean, I definitely have my own opinions about Michelin star. Um, and I know many people do. Um, it's not like you can't go to Michelin star restaurant, um, and not have a, and have a bad experience. happens and not be impressed. Um, so yeah, I, yeah. It's food is so subjective.
32:09And I think that's too why I come from it with this very like  symbolic interactionist type  theory  where you're  interacting with the food through the ways that you've experienced life.  And yeah, so every time you sit at a table, sure, your experience at that restaurant might've been one of,  but another person might be like, wow, this is the best meal I've ever had.
32:38It's amazing. So  again, it's why I want to have this dialogue about food and how it's so subjective and why authenticity exists.  And it's just an idea that's  very subjective. And if you come with it, come at the idea or the narrative with this, it needs to be this, or it can only be this.  Of course you're going to think it doesn't exist because
33:06that very dichotomous attitude is going to put it in a box, which a lot of people, you know, a lot of people like that. I mean, they like to have things very  defined. They find comfort in that. Yeah, categorized is the word I would use.  It's amazing that we don't fight over food more than we do as human beings. You would think with all the different people's tastes and
33:36and appreciations for the different foods and different flavors and different textures, we would actually have fist fights about our opinions about food. Yeah,  I agree. You would think that especially when we have  so much to say about so many other subjects in society. Yeah, it's amazing that we don't come to blows.  I have one more thing that I want to say and then I will cut you loose because you need to get ready for your next thing and so do I.
34:04One of the things that I really, really miss about where I grew up is that Maine is a tourist state  and the people who live there make their money being a tourist state. And there are many, many,  many small mom and pop restaurants that are fabulous. And Minnesota is not a tourist state, so we don't have that kind of thing here. That's the thing I miss the most, I think, about having moved from there to here.
34:32Yeah, no, I mean, I would love to talk about food in Minnesota. I think it'd be great. As someone that's never been there, I'm really fascinated by our conversation. I feel like I could do a whole another conversation about it. And it's like I said, it's one of the reasons that drew me to the idea of authentic food because I want to have these very like, real experiences that can't be duplicated.
35:02Yeah, maybe you should start a podcast, go with your blog and then I can come back and talk to you about the food experience in Maine and the food experience in Minnesota. Well,  you know what, you're about the  20th person that's told me that and I  will definitely reach out if I need some blog, some podcast tips because I wouldn't even know where to start on that one. Honestly, it's easier than you think. Believe me, I wouldn't be doing it if it was difficult.  But.
35:31But yeah, it's been, it's been a 30 year stretch for me to get used to living in a different state regarding food. And if you had told me when I got yanked, kicking and screaming to Minnesota when I was 21 or 22, that it would be a food thing that would still hang me up this, this many years later, I would have laughed. But it is, there are things that I just accept that I don't get to have unless I go home to visit.
36:01Mm-hmm. Yeah, I get that and you find comfort in that I'm sure. Yes. Oh, yes when I roll it across the border into Maine, I'm like, yes in the land of my food dreams. I'm in it. Yay.  I love that for you.  Yep, and when we get back here also, there are foods that I have  grown to love in Minnesota too. So I have the best of both worlds. It's great.  Awesome. I love them. Mm-hmm.
36:28All right, Janna, thank you so much for your time today. I appreciate it. Of course. Well, thanks for the invite.  And  I hope to get to Minnesota soon. It sounds amazing.  You should come in like June or September because it's not so hot and it's not quite so buggy. So those are the two months you want to come. OK,  noted. All right. Thank you. Have a good afternoon. You too. Thanks so much.
 

Seeds To Savor

Today I'm talking with Annie at Seeds To Savor. You can follow on Facebook as well.
A Tiny Homestead Podcast is sponsored by Homegrowncollective.org.
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00:00You're listening to A Tiny Homestead, the podcast comprised entirely of conversations with homesteaders, cottage food producers, and crafters, and topics adjacent. I'm your host, Mary Lewis.  A Tiny Homestead podcast is sponsored by Homegrown Collective, a free-to-use farm-to-table platform emphasizing local connections with ability to sell online, buy, sell, trade in local garden groups, and help us grow a new food system.  You can find them at homegrowncollective.org. If you're enjoying this podcast, please like, subscribe.
00:29share it with a friend or leave a comment. Thank you. Today I'm talking with Annie at Seeds to Save Her Farm and she's in Colorado. Good morning, Annie. How are you? Good morning, Mary. It's so nice to be here. Thank you for having me. Thank you for coming. I love it when the people I invite have time to talk with me. It's really great. What's the weather like in Colorado this morning? Oh, it's a gorgeous day today. Yeah. We're like, we're at, I think we're going to get up to like 65. So just, it's perfect.
00:59Nice. It's always sunny here. Well, that's awesome. It's only going to get up to like 30 here today. Where are you, Mary? Minnesota. Minnesota. Okay. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And it's, it's really sunny, but it's windy and it's cold. The news, the good news is that the weather guy says that's going to warm up on Wednesday and we're just going to keep warming up until we get to like, you know,
01:24reasonable April, end of April temperatures for Minnesota, which is 50s, 60s for the highs. Yeah. Yeah. In here, it's like we can get snow. We had a blizzard on Mother's Day three years in a row. And so we're like, I'm sure you're the same there, right? So you're covering your blossoms, right? So the apple trees are in full bloom, the plums are in full bloom, the peaches are in full bloom, and then along comes a blizzard.
01:53We honestly, I've lived here for over 30 years and I have not seen snow, real snow in May, but I've seen heavy frost in May and that's what does in our blossoms.  we keep our fingers and toes crossed in May that it does not frost.  So, okay, so tell me about yourself and what you do and I know you do a whole bunch of stuff so start wherever you would like.  I always tell people I've worn a lot of hats.
02:22Um, yeah, I do a whole bunch of stuff. So  I am a cookbook author, I guess we'll start with that. I have two cookbooks  out. The first one is called, um, where Fino's happy heart.  Um, and it is a collection.  if in Colorado are, um,  the iconic ingredient,  um, the state food  is green chili. And if you know Colorado, um, it is a, it's a.
02:53very regional thing.  We and it's in Colorado and New Mexico. So Hatch of course is like most people are familiar with.  But there's always this like very friendly rivalry between Colorado and New Mexico who has the better green chili. I'm not going to say who I think. My green chili is the best. So there you go.  My husband is  indigenous to Colorado. And so he always talks about growing up with green chili, but you know simmering on the back stove all the time, always.
03:23So that was kind of a passion project and I had a grant. I went down to do work with a senior center and I collected stories and recipes and we created that cookbook. So that's where that came from and  it's a lot of fun.  About a year after I published my first cookbook,  I was diagnosed with celiac disease.  that was actually in the spring of 2023.
03:53And  I had lost my best friend who I like, she was my friend since I was like, you know, a kid.  She was,  and  she,  and then six days later, my sister died from a fall,  complications from a fall. And then three weeks later, I was diagnosed with celiac disease when I was in first place in a national cooking competition. So it was like, was,  was flattening.
04:23Literally flattening. And when I was able to finally look up again,  I realized that I was really, I guess I found gratitude.  And I realized that I was really fortunate that I was able to  handle food. I know how to cook food. I grew up in Ogallala, Nebraska.
04:50Heartland of America and the agriculture, agricultural.  So food has always been just a part of my life, right? So like my mother was an amazing cook. actually  known as an amazing cook. We did all the entertaining and all those things.  So when I realized that  I was a, know, that I felt fortunate about what I  can do,
05:19I felt like I could help other people. I kept seeing people say like, it's hard to navigate a truly gluten-free lifestyle. Like  with celiac disease, you can't have any gluten at all. That means cross-contamination. That means like you can't have a burger grilled on a grill where they've grilled a bun.  Or, you I mean,  you can't eat in certain restaurants. It's a lot. And as a food writer, for me, it was identity loosening. Like I felt like I'd lost my identity and I...
05:48didn't quite know, you I was like, what do do now? So I wrote my book, my cookbook, took me about a little over a year and that is simply, it's called Simply Gluten Free, Real Ingredients for Everyday Life. And it's really about, it's very, it's probably the way that your audience cooks. It would be the way that your listeners cook, that us homesteaders are like, we're like back to nature people, right?
06:17So we cook from real ingredients. We don't use a lot of processed foods.  But that's not how  a lot of people cook. And a lot of people don't know how to cook.  I felt like that was something like my homesteading background, my agricultural background, my food background, all were ways that I could help people navigate this world of living gluten-free because it's very, very, it's very much harder than I think people realize.
06:44And celiac disease is life-threatening. it's not, you know, it's, can't, it's, you just can't cross the line ever.  So  that's what, that's what I, I guess that's my  current, my, my current self.  We do our farm is seeds to savor farm.  We do seed preservation work here.  So.
07:11I guess I can, tell you  how we got into that. How I got into running.  Yeah,  so I taught middle school  in Aurora, Colorado for a little over a decade.  And  I took my students to Washington, DC. That was one of our things that we would do.  And  I would take them to, it was May.
07:37And we would go to Mount Vernon, which is the home of George Washington. And I was an American history teacher also. So that was what I did  in one of my lives.  we,  in May, Mount Vernon, the docents in Mount Vernon are doing their  seed and plant sale.  And  I was completely
08:06captivated by the thought of taking seeds from there and bringing them back to my home and growing those seeds in my home.  And I just thought that was the most amazing thing.  So I started really getting diving in deeper and started collecting seeds from historically significant people and places. So I  had seeds from Van Gogh's garden and I have seeds from Georgia O'Keeffe's garden and
08:35Shakespeare, the Anthos from the Shakespearean garden. And that just really captivated me. But when I started digging deeper, I realized that as lovely as that is, our seed security and our seed diversity has decreased by something 90%. I regularly see 80 % in the last 100 years.
09:06So what came clear to me was that we were really at risk of having a monoculture environment for all of our produce  and the risk of losing our seed heritage. So  I  actually watched a documentary called Seeds, the Untold Story and the only place I know of to get it is Amazon.
09:36And not everybody's doing that right now. But  I'm not the only person I know to get it. they interview one of the people that they interviewed talked about like the seed vault in,  you know,  up  in Svalbard. I think that's right, Norway.  And just the risks to our seed diversity to losing these all these this, you know, varieties of seeds and our heritage. So
10:06One of the people that they interviewed was Bill McDormand and  he and his wife, Belle, are the founders of the Rocky Mountain Seed Alliance. And I was like, these are my people.  I need to talk to them. So I reached out to them and  they  invited me to attend, they have a seed school that they do. And it's a week long intensive.
10:34about seed preservation and how to save seeds and  how to start them  and  the importance  of  us preserving and growing seeds outside of what you buy in a big box store packaged by Monsanto or Bayer, guess.  And so we learned a lot and then  my husband my husband did the class too and we
11:03have gone out into the community to teach  how to save seeds. And we start with seeds that aren't easily crossed, like lettuce and beans, because they're self-pollinators. So that's usually where we start. we donated to seed  libraries.
11:34That's the work we do  with seed preservation.  Nice. Okay. All right. So I have a couple of questions out of all of that because that's what I do. the books, it's High Prairie Press, right? Yes. Go ahead. I'm sorry. Is that your publishing company?  It is. So my degree is in English and I taught
12:03reading, writing  for years.  my end, when I was a teenager  living in Ogallala, Nebraska,  my dream was to be publisher. That's what I wanted to do. I wanted to go to New York and I was going to work with Big Five and I was going to be a And that's not how life worked. really,  you know, I was just recently attended a big publishing summit, the Women in Publishing Summit, which is attracts like  all the public, you know.
12:32Everybody's there, Ingram and Lulu. I've been going to this for a few years. So I like, feel like I have sort of an identity crisis right now because I'm like, you know, an author and a cookbook and all of that, which kind of happened almost just by accident, to be perfectly honest.  And then I'm also doing have a publishing company,  which was my dream, which has been my dream my whole life.
12:59Um, which I love and I love, you know, being a writer and a publisher. I love that. And my, and high prairie press was really the fulfillment of a dream. When I started, when I was, so what I was planning on doing at that, um, let's say in 2023, when I, when I was telling you about the spring of 2023, was literally on my way to meet with a chef who wanted me to publish his cookbook here in Denver. And so I was.
13:27driving and my brother-in-law called and he said, you need to come and you need to come right now. So  I dropped that clearly.  that didn't happen. So my life went in very different direction after that.  I was talking to  the women in my publishing summit and some of my colleagues who are publishers and kind of dealing with this out there
13:56you know, talking about the books, talking about the cookbooks, which is great. And I love that. I love that was able to, you know,  the cookbook has been a great thing, but  my heart is in publishing and your audience is actually who I want to publish what I want to publish.  And I was offered, I was offered to be an imprint for a publishing company in Colorado Springs. And it was a tough one to, I actually ended up turning it down because
14:23I was like, no, I want to be my own. I want to do this. I want it to be my publishing company. But what I want to publish is exactly what your listeners do. Books about seed saving, books about homesteading, books about canning, books about food in general, preservation, growing, all of that. That's the information that food security, that...
14:51I worked a lot in food security because I taught eighth grade in an impoverished, well, seventh and eighth grade, but I taught middle school in an area with  a lot of poverty and the symptoms of poverty. so  I just kept food in my cupboard for my kids. They needed food.  If you don't eat, you can't learn.  And food producers are the base of our...
15:20our existence, right? Like we know that. And food security is so important. So that's what I want to publish actually. I love that I did the cookbook. I love being an author. I love her. I'm a writer. Like that's what I've always been. So that fits. But really my heart is in getting that information out to people, you know?  How  to do it. Yeah. So my next question is...
15:48Are they paperback books that you put out? are they, how are you doing it? Is it digital? Is it hardcover? What is it? Sure. Yes. I love talking about publishing. Me too. Love talking about publishing. I loved your interview with the editor of... it Hoving? Yes, I loved that. I was like, oh yes, I hear you. I feel you.
16:18Okay, so,  um,  my books were both designed in Canva. Okay.  They tell you, you can't do that. And I said, hold my beer. And,  you know, and actually, I said, hold my cider, because I can't drink beer  anymore. The thing I get back the most is how beautiful they are, because I'm an artist, apart. And so that's, that's everything I do,  I infuse with art. So it's, it's,  the books are beautiful. They're beautiful.
16:49Um
16:51We go through, so, you know, okay, so all of my colleagues, all of my publishing colleagues all say the same thing, like, you know, at the publishing summit in March, which if you're interested in publishing, you should certainly attend the Women in Publishing Summit run by Alexa Big Wharf. She's the person in publishing right now. And we go through Ingram. so you can really, Ingram has like,
17:19So Ingram has been the public printer and distributor of books forever. They are it. When I man, I was a manager for Walden Books. If any of you remember Walden Books. I do.  Way back when, right? I worked for Walden Books when I lived in San Diego in the eighties. And right down the road was an Ingram warehouse.  They, because, know, like San Diego shipping, right?
17:49Yeah. Huge warehouse. They were the printer, the printer and distributor in the world then in the eighties. Well established. They are still it. And we had a lot of conversation about that at the summit, right? Like, so it's like, they're expensive. Like that's part of the issue is that they're expensive.  You can do almost any trim size with Ingram and you can do...
18:17you can do pretty much any, you know, can do hardback and then you have paper weights that you can choose from. In fact, when I first finished,  when I first did the, cookbook, I chose 50 pound paper and it was too light  weight for a cookbook. Like you want your pages to have some substance in a cookbook, right? Cause you're going to set a spoon on it or whatever.  So I, that didn't work. And I went back and did a, did a higher paperweight and it's so much better.
18:47Um, we can do anything. We can do eBooks, paperback, hardback, any trim size.  Um, we do go through Ingram.  If you don't go through Ingram  at some point, you will not be ordered in bookstores or gift stores because they all go through Ingram.  That's a problem, right? I mean, clearly, but it is what it is. Like we have to work with that. all of what I, I guess what I was, what I was started to say earlier, but didn't finish is that
19:16all of my colleagues, you know, we're all like, the world of publishing right now is the wild, wild west.  It is a, pardon my language, shit show at the moment. And that's good and bad. we, you know,  go ahead. No, you had something to say, Mary.  No, just said, mm-hmm. And the reason it's a shit show is because there are so  many  ways to get a book out to people now.
19:45I mean, and it's going,  the reality is, and I've always said this, the cream rises to this top, right? Like that's not gonna change.  And there are things that aren't gonna change as far as like, you you can't replace heart, right? You can't replace that with like AI or with, you can't do that. And that's a whole, right? Like that's a whole world. But  yeah, it is. And it's been going on for, you know, it's been going on for almost 20 years, like really the upheaval.
20:14I would say 15 maybe in publishing and who knows when the dust will settle. But for now,  know, we as publishers and through, you know, women in publishing and through our, you know, I have a, in fact, I have a workshop directly following this interview. am doing a workshop with Alexa.  It's, you know, we're, we're, we're together. We're banding together. We're learning.  We're uplifting each other.
20:42We're helping each other.  I love that community. The women in publishing community is amazing.  And that's because Alexa, that's because she infuses it with her love and  care and concern for quality.  And all of us are, all of us are. it's, it  is the Wild, Wild West. It is.  And it's, like I said earlier, it's good and bad, right? Like it, it,  creates opportunity.
21:13But it also, like you said, like, you know, anyone can put a book out, right? I mean, anyone can do it now. And that's who knows? I don't know. Who knows? think I think it's fabulous because some people really do have a great thing that they want to get out in the world and they actually can write.  And this takes some of the barriers away. But there's a lot of crap out there, too. You and I both know this.  So, OK, so we've been talking about
21:41Publishing and writing in books for at least 20 minutes  I would love to have you back and talk about this more about you wanting to publish like the people I  Would love to do that because I just think I agree with you so completely that like this is opportunity isn't it like this is opportunity for people to To you know teach others and  get their voice heard
22:09Yeah, and I would love to have you talk about how you want to do that, know, as the publisher, because most people don't know how any of this works. I mean, I do because I helped a couple of friends ebook publish years ago and I didn't know what I was doing. I'm really good at editing, so that worked to my favor. I made grocery money and they made grocery money. We were happy with that. It worked out okay. So tell me, for the last...
22:35eight minutes or so, tell me about your  farm because that's the other part I wanted to hear about. Yes, of course, of course. So Seeds to Savor, we're Seeds to Savor farm  and  that  we are at 6,300 feet. So we have a lot of, we  really deal with a lot of challenges  of,  well, let me just say that when I bought this land, I weren't five and a half acres.  And when I bought this land, I bought it for horses and horses and growing are not the same thing.
23:04That has been a challenge. There's so many challenges, just the wind.  And when you sit here at 6,300 feet,  so we can see from Pike's Peak to Long's Peak. We have a view of the entire Front Range.  But that means wind, like the wind constant.  And the sun  shines all of the time. And we don't have trees.  We're here on the prairie. So it's been a lot of challenges.  We've learned that certain things
23:33Like we grow potatoes really well here.  I grew tomatoes for a chef for a while and  heirloom tomatoes. it was just, there's such water consumers and we really,  we're really, really careful with our water here.  Colorado is the only state that has no water that flows in, nor does any water touch our borders. So all of our water falls from the sky.  And so that's...
24:00It's a challenge, you know, and we live, we're on  a  well. So that's an aquifer that is,  there's so much to say about water in Colorado, so I won't go there. our  aquifer has dropped.  I've been here for 25 years.  Our well pump went dry. We  had to replace our well pump, which was terrifying.  But water is such an issue. So I stopped growing.
24:29I just don't do that anymore. We grow a lot of brassicas and we do,  I don't do as much, I used to do some market gardening, but I haven't done that for a while. But we might, we've been talking about kind of getting back into that. We're going, we're doing a cattle panel greenhouse that I'm super excited about, because I want to put a pool in it. So we're trying to design it so we can put a pool in it.  The pool  would be a heat sink.
24:57Um, also add moisture to very, very dry hair, very dry hair. We are semi-arid. Um, so that's a challenge too. Uh, lavender grows really well here, just like, you know, um, but it's, it's, I've been focused the last couple of years on more on publishing and writing and producing. And so, um, I haven't put as much energy in, but
25:26We are definitely energized to do that this year. We're getting chickens again. I haven't had chickens for a couple of years. I've missed them. So we're getting chicks this spring from a local breeder. So I'm super excited about that. just got new chickens like five weeks ago from our friends who let their chickens breed, think.
25:54I could be wrong. She may actually order eggs and hatch them. I don't know. But either way, I consider them to be their chickens until they're our chickens. Absolutely. I get that. It's been so fabulous having our own eggs again from our chickens. Oh my gosh. So I understand why you want chickens again. Oh, I'm so excited. Number one. That's so cute. Yeah, it's really fun.
26:23To know that you're getting your eggs from your chickens, but it's also nice that they're not grocery store eggs. Oh, so many things, right? Exactly. agree. Colorado, so Colorado passed a law that all chickens have to be cage free. You can't sell all chickens, that you can't, that's it in the grocery stores, or all cage free eggs now, as of January. But are they really, are they really cage free?
26:53Right. No, and they still have no room. Like they're still just crowded in a big, yeah, they're not in cages, but they're still enclosed. Yeah. So yeah, no, I agree. It's not the same as definitely not the same, but I do think it's a step in the right direction, you know, of just like not allowing, you know, I've always, I felt that way since I was a kid, you know, growing up.
27:16My best friend had a ranch.  my parents didn't, were, my dad was an engineer, but my best friend had a ranch and farm and ranch. And so I grew up wrangling cattle and all the things.  I've just always said there has to be a limit. It's meat. I'm not a vegetarian. I eat vegetarian sometimes, but meat production has to be humane.  We need a humane way to produce meat.
27:43That's, know, so I feel like it's a step in the right direction. But yeah, you're totally right. But not everybody can have their own chicken. So. Yeah. And I was kind of being a smart ass because I talk to people all the time for the podcast about these things. And cage free to me is a really weird term because if you're going to have chickens, you have to be able to keep them with you somehow.
28:13And our chickens have a coop. have a run off the coop so they can go outside and they're outside in the sun, in the grass, eating bugs and stuff.  we have some, we have some escapees cause we haven't clipped their wing yet.  And every time I see the one that gets out first, I'm like, a scupey, she a scupey.  My son laughs at me.  But,  what I would like is that chickens aren't like
28:4140 chickens stuck in a  box.  know, that's the hard part for me because  I've said this before and I'm going say it again. I have a really soft heart when it comes to  living beings. I mean, I even sometimes get just a little bit of a,  when I trim herbs to go in my salad  because plants are living too.
29:08They just don't make any noise so you don't know how they feel about what you do to them.  I agree.  I agree with that. So  whatever we can do to make it better, and I can't define better for you because I don't know what it is, but to make it better. And it's hard because some people have pushed back at me and been like, well, what do you want to do? And I'm like, I don't know. I just want it to be better.
29:35And one of the people I was talking with said, until you can define your version of better, that doesn't help. And I'm like, I get it. I know. So it's fine. I'm just thrilled you have a farm.  mean, I think everybody should have a farm and not everyone does and not everybody wants one. But for those who do want a farm or a homestead, I hope with all my heart that you eventually get it because it is so worth it. It is.
30:03It is. And I think that's, you know, I guess that's why what I want to publish is about, you know, exactly that, right? Like we want it to be better.  I mean, I agree with you.  I hear where you're coming from. And  I don't know that I agree that we all have to define exactly what that is. It's really sometimes just in the heart, right? It's our heart. It's not  necessarily something that has to be defined in your head.
30:33I think everything has to be that way. And I think it's okay to just say, well, this is in my heart and I feel like we can do better. And I think that's what we're doing. I think those of us who are producers and those of us who live this lifestyle and understand this lifestyle,
31:04you know, are trying to do it better and are trying to help others to do it better,  you know? Exactly. I have, you know, I, it's, there are, you know, whether it's chickens or, or whatever, the  meat, the mass produced, you know, my daughter works for Kroger. She's a cheesemonger, which makes, which makes me happy, of course.
31:30Yeah, so she's the manager of the Murray's Cheese at the Kroger nearest. And  she talks a lot about like, you know, a food waste, because it's just, it really bothers her.  And the people around her are just kind of like, yeah, whatever. And she's got her whole store composting, like she's, it's a big store. And she's like, they compost now, because she's like, makes it happen. Because, you know, it's important. It's important. You have that awareness. And like, she, she'll say to like,
31:59The people that she works with are like, well, they'll do it. Like corporate's going to do it. She's like, you are corporate. That's who you are.  Like you are representative of this grocery store. And that means that, you know, we are, we are that that's us.  So she makes them.  love that. That's awesome.  I'm so proud of her. And I'm so, I'm so glad you brought up cheese because I heard on the news yesterday that a lot of cheeses are imported.
32:27And the tariffs are going to affect that. So I talked to my son yesterday. He's a grown up. He's an adult  and he still lives with us. And I said, you want to learn how to make cheese? And  he said, I said, yeah.  Said I will get ahold of the guy that sells raw milk over in Montgomery, Minnesota  and we'll try making some of our own mozzarella. And he was like, I am. It's really easy and you'll love it. It's so much fun.
32:51Yeah, he said, I am all in. said, and then we can figure out how to make ricotta, because you can make that pretty easy too. And then I said, we have to look into how to make cheddar, because we eat a lot of cheddar cheese around here when we have cheese. And that's a whole different thing. So we're going to learn. And you can get good cheddar. it from the US? There's, Telemuk is a great cheddar. You're in cheese country, almost. I'm adjacent. I'm cheese country adjacent, yes.
33:21There you go. Yeah, she said that. So the the when we had our launch party for the book, we had it at a cidery, local cidery, Holly Daly, who I'll shout out for because they're amazing. Our local brewery. I'm sorry. Not cidery. They're a brewery. They brew real they brew gluten free beer. Nice. So we heard our Yeah, they're amazing. They're wonderful. They just went public, I think. And they
33:51We did, my daughter did a tray for us, right? So we bought this charcuterie from King Super's and  she did the, I probably shouldn't say this, right? She upgraded it.  But the blue cheese was called Rogue River blue cheese. If you like blue cheese, okay, this is important.  Rogue River blue cheese, that's what she did. I've never had anything like it.
34:19It is the number one cheese in the world. So not the number one blue cheese, but the number one cheese in the world. And she told me yesterday or this weekend, they came out for, did a crab boil  and they came out and, she said  that Rogue River just announced that they had extra, they have like surplus because normally she can only get it at Christmas. She's never gotten it in the middle of the year before. And she's like, I'm ordering some. So Rogue River.
34:50is the blue cheese if you're a blue cheese fan and it is in surplus right now. I never know what surprises I'm going to get on the podcast and I do not love blue cheese but I bet people who are listening do so. Good to know. Thank you Annie. Appreciate that. All right we are at almost 35 minutes and I know you another thing to get to so I'm going to let you go.
35:16Thank you so much for your time today. I appreciate it. Absolutely. I appreciated it. And my website is  highpraripress.org or seedstosaver.org.com.  And I will put those in the notes. Perfect. All right. Thank you. Have a great day. Thank It was so much fun. It was. Thanks.
 

Kesinger Homestead

Today I'm talking with Jessica and Renee at Kesinger Homestead. 
A Tiny Homestead Podcast is sponsored by Homegrowncollective.org.
If you'd like to support me in growing this podcast, like, share, subscribe or leave a comment. Or just buy me a coffee 
https://buymeacoffee.com/lewismaryes
00:00You're listening to A Tiny Homestead, the podcast comprised entirely of conversations with homesteaders, cottage food producers, and crafters, and topics adjacent. I'm your host, Mary Lewis.  A Tiny Homestead podcast is sponsored by Homegrown Collective, a free-to-use farm-to-table platform emphasizing local connections with ability to sell online, buy, sell, trade in local garden groups, and help us grow a new food system.  You can find them at homegrowncollective.org. If you're enjoying this podcast, please like, subscribe.
00:29share it with a friend or leave a comment. Thank you. Today I'm talking with Jessica and Renee at Kesinger Homestead. And I don't know who should get first billing on this because Jessica and Renee are sisters and I don't know who's oldest. I'm oldest, Jessica.  I'll take that. I think I said it right.  Yes, you did. And I would normally say, how's the weather? But I'm pretty sure I know how the weather is. So I'm looking out my window and it's and spitting snowflakes right now. And  you're in where in Minnesota?
00:58Anoka County. We're north of those cities.  It's not snowing here yet.  It will be.  I'm sure it will.  You guys are probably going get more snow than we will in Lasur. Yeah, I'm really hoping this is it. I'm hoping this is the last hurrah of winter because  I'm tired of it. I'm ready for it to be over. It's April 1st, damn it.  We are all ready for it to be over.
01:26This last snowfall was pretty. I'm not some pretty pictures and such, but I'm not even giving it that. It was not welcome.  Jess wants to just live somewhere tropical.  Oh, well, she is in the wrong state for that, but I  hope you at least get to go on vacation somewhere tropical. I do.  do.  Okay, good.  All right. So  normally I would say tell me about yourselves and Kessinger.
01:55Kesinger or Kesinger? Kessinger. Kesinger, Homestead. But I looked at your Facebook page this morning and you guys have a cow that is imminently due with a calf or two. Yes. Oh gosh. me about that.  Oh gosh, what if it's two?  So she, yeah, so her window to deliver started about a week ago. So we had a live bull on the property. So we're not sure exactly when she got bred.
02:22But she is showing signs. She's swollen back there. She's just a little bit irritable. And this morning she may have lost her mucus plug. I know everyone wants to hear about that. It's pretty gross. No, it's not. I am hopeful that this snowstorm gives us a baby. So that's my goal today. Yeah. How late did you stay up last night watching? I was watching her on the camera all night.
02:50As much as I want your cow to be more comfortable,  I also would like to have at least 30 minutes to talk to you guys before you have to like run off to help her.  Because this is real life listeners. This is what happens on homesteads. Animals go into labor when they're ready. And it doesn't matter what you're doing, you got to drop everything and go see if they need help. Yes, exactly. Exactly. So, I've Googled how to take care of cow and labor.  we're...
03:17We're semi-prepared. It's our first year with cows.  Oh, okay. How many cows do you have? So we have two moms  and they both came with babies. So we have four and then both of the moms are pregnant again. So we'll have six this summer. I'm so jealous you're going to have calves. I'm jealous. They're so cute. I know. I know. And I think they'll let me snuggle them as my, I've tried to make them my best friend the past year. So. They should.
03:45My goal. It's my goal. So yeah, we're all about all the babies, baby chicks, baby cows, maybe a baby pony next year. As we're looking at little Coco out there in her pasture right now.  Uh huh. Yeah.  Um, is she, is she bred? No,  we've been Googling that.  So that might be we between the two of us, we have six kids. So  the more ponies, the better, think.
04:14Well, you won't have to rent one for the birthday party if you already own one. that would be great. Exactly. Yeah, she gets passed around for birthday parties for sure. Oh, funny. All right. So tell me how this all happened because you guys are sisters, you live four and a half miles away from each other and you're both doing homesteading. So what's the history here?
04:36So I, this is Jessica.  I started about 10 years ago when I met my husband. So he lived in a town home  and when we were dating, he had home studying books on his shelf, which was funny. Cause again, town home living. Um, so we were just kind of meant to be, he was more than happy to move out to the country with me.  Um, but he's an engineer. So he is the best at optimizing things. So
05:01That's how we're able to do so many different things on a limited amount of time is because we put a lot of work and time in the front end. So the maintenance is minimal. he's helped me with that. then Renee just got interested and excited and I'd give her a free tomato plants. And eventually I convinced her to take some chicks home and yeah. I mean, so I've been in it for, this is my second year and
05:30mainly just chicks when I have a small garden. So she does a lot more of the homesteading than I do, but I'm learning from her and growing in that way. But when she gave me eggs, she's like, and this is from the cream crested leg bar rooster. So these are all be Easter eggers. And I think this one is from my Rhode Island red and all these different names. like, I have no idea what all these are. I'm not going to remember all this. And now here I am two years later. knows all of them. I know all of them.
06:00You sucked her into the lifestyle. did.  You did a good job. I'm going to say I didn't,  I wasn't super into it to begin with. I'm like, okay, yeah, cool. Chicks, chicks are fun. They're cute. But then like, yeah, I got obsessed. It's fun. Chicken math is  real. You need all of them.  I hear chicken math is real a lot. It's really bad. It is. You need all the colors.
06:26Because it's just as easy to raise 50 chickens as it is to raise five. You just have to have bigger vessels of food and water. Yes, yes, absolutely. I have not gotten sucked into the needing to have all the different colors and different colored eggs. I really do. You should. No, I can't afford it right now.
06:51And for us, the eggs are just a means to an end for protein because everyone I've talked to for the last month and a half, who I've talked to about chickens and laying hens, has been all about, it's really nice to have your own laying hens because then you have your own eggs and you're not paying $10 to $12 a dozen at the store. And I can vouch for that because we just got our new dozen at chickens like five weeks ago, something like that.
07:21And we'd had chickens before. my husband came home from shopping. He was down in Mankato doing stuff at Menards and Fleet Farm and stock pick up groceries. And he was like, six eggs is going for $8. And I said, well, I said, I'm going to contact our chicken dealer and see if she has any laying hens because this is crazy.
07:47So I I contacted our chicken dealer slash broker and said do you have any laying hens that are ready to go? And she said they'll be laying in four weeks. How many do you want? I said all of them, but I can't afford them I would love 12 and she said cool and I said how much she said $23 a bird and I thought to myself, you know, I am willing to do that. That is fine
08:10So I actually got into cows last year because I got mad at beef prices. I went to Target, I paid $6 for a pound of ground beef from an animal that was raised who knows how from who knows where. And I went home and I sat down with my husband and I said, I want to get cows. He said, okay. So I'm like, okay, we need to run before he changes his mind and researches this. And I had cows on the property within 12 days.
08:39Jess is very impulsive when it comes to animals. I think it was around the time of tax refund. So I had some cash that was just sitting there begging to be spent. And I'm like, I'm going to, I had to put some different gates on for cows.  Um,  but the rest of our horse fencing was sufficient. So we just had to change around a couple of gates and take my horse trailer, go pick up a couple cows. And that was that. And ta-da. And now we have cows, no beef yet, but cows.
09:08We're starting.  Whale cows produce more baby cows and then you can take some of the cows  and butcher them at two years old or whatever it is. Yep, two years. So we'll butcher this winter will be our first time. So we're excited for our own meat where we know that the animals have one bad day at the end and that's it. Otherwise they are happy and loved and spoiled and we know what they're  eating.
09:35Lena's getting some apple scraps from applesauce I made this morning. Oh yes, they love their  carrots and apples and everything from the fridge.  And they don't mind the soft carrots from the fridge if you have any. Exactly, they're not picky.  Yeah, that's why we love our chickens because if things are not quite up to par for us to want to eat,  we're like, oh, we have chickens again and out it goes to the chickens. They love it. Yeah. They never feel bad about it.
10:04Exactly.  So cows, chickens, kids.  Do I miss? Oh, you have a horse, right? Or a pony? Yeah, but we have,  I have two riding horses and then, and this is Josie, and then we have a pony that goes between the two of us.  Okay. And then we garden. Yeah. Okay. Good. Gardening is going to come here very shortly.  The horses, are they, are they just for fun or do they have any jobs?
10:34They are to make me happy. Okay. So that, is their job. Other than that, no job. Yeah. Manure. Manure. Compost. Yeah. Sure. We'll pretend that's their purpose. It's really, really good, um, fertilizers. So yeah. Exactly. Yeah. I asked because back in the olden days, as it were,
10:59people had jobs for their horses, they pulled carts or they pulled the plow or they whatever, they had jobs.  And horses are an expensive hobby. And if you can,  you can afford it. I applaud it because I think horses are beautiful.  Yeah. But I feel like they don't have as many jobs as they used to have.  No. So back in COVID days,  when everything was shutting down and chaos was happening and everyone was uncertain about what was going to go on.
11:28Me and my husband laughed. like, you know, if we can't get fuel, we're going to jump on those horses and we'll still have transportation.  So we did joke about that.  It has not been needed, but, and you know, if it really does hit the fan, they, that, that is protein.  I don't think it'll ever come to that.  never know.  Life is crazy right now.  No  kidding.  I don't think I could do it, but.
11:56I tell my husband that and then he allows the animals to stay.  Well, that's good. I would hate for you to have to give up any of your animals because I can hear how much you love all of them.  I do.  So I don't want to, I really don't want to go into why things are crazy right now because I try to avoid politics like the plague on my podcast.  So let's talk about your gardening. Do both of you garden or just one of you?
12:22Mostly just me, Jessica. I'm kind of getting Renee into it. She's coming around. I'm going to teach her how to can this year. Nice. Yeah. So I haven't really gotten into canning. So everything that comes from my garden gets eaten in the fall. So it's not a really super big garden, but I want to get into grapes this year. So we're going to plant some grapes. Yeah, I don't have a whole lot in my garden, but Jess is going to get me going.
12:50I have a tomato addiction.  It's ridiculous.  It's a problem. So I started with probably six heirloom tomatoes and then I went to 12 and then I went to 30. Last year I had 54 plants plus a couple cherries.  I need all the different colors of tomatoes. It goes back to the colors of the eggs. need one of every color and everything that I do.  Well, that's okay.
13:19That's fine. So lots and lots of tomatoes.  I do can them.  I, when I run out of energy, I just dice and freeze them. I was selling them for a while.  Um, but then I realized I can consume all of the tomatoes in a year.  Yeah. I love tomatoes.  Well, I suspect you probably will never have cancer because tomatoes are really high in antioxidants.
13:45Mm-hmm. Well, that's so cancer. That is a huge driver in  us producing our own food. Uh-huh. So I'm a PA, so I work in family practice.  And the cancer rates are just terrifying.  The past probably 10 years, we're just seeing more and more cancers in younger people. And it's got to be what we're eating. It's got to be the preservatives, all the chemicals that we're consuming. So if we can produce food on our own property,
14:15then we know what we're eating and what we're fueling our kids with.  So  Whole Foods is where it's at.  Absolutely. I was going to put a word in there that I don't say on the podcast either, so you can guess which one it was.  Absolutely.  I know.  You know, we are what we eat. We've been saying that forever.  But I think it's finally time that people are waking up and realizing that. So.  Yeah.
14:43Yep. And it's such a bummer because we, I don't know, I'm 55. You guys are in your what? Late 20s or early 30s? Yeah. I don't know if you were raised like I was, but I mean, it was nothing to ride my bike a mile and a half to the store, pick up a Dr. Pepper and a bag of Doritos and eat it on the way home. Exactly. And we didn't think anything of it. And I don't, I don't do Dr. Pepper because I can't afford it. Pop is unbelievably expensive. And I don't do Doritos because I have, um,
15:11and like an allergy or a reaction to MSG and MSG is in almost every flavored chip known to man. And so I just don't do any of that stuff anymore. And what I really love to do is just take some lemon juice, put it in a glass, throw some water in it, add like a teaspoon of sugar, stir it up, and that's lemonade. Exactly. And I am, I'm going to say something that people either hate or love.
15:40I don't think that sugar is a bad thing for you. I think that too much sugar is a bad thing for you.  And I don't think that butter is bad for you.  think margarine probably is bad for you. I feel like it's all moderation and even moderation in moderation sometimes. To me, I feel that it's  the number of ingredients. So like you said, your lemonade, three ingredients,  butter.
16:09One ingredient, two,  salt. If add salt to it.  But yeah, staying away from all the chemically derived  foods  is definitely the healthy way to go. Yes.  My husband just made his amazing herbed bread on Sunday  and he knows and I know exactly what's in this bread and it makes the most beautiful loaves  and the crumb is amazing.
16:37I just, look at what he does in an hour and a half, you know, barring the  rise time.  And it's so much better than what you can buy at the store and it doesn't have any preservatives in it. Yeah.  I've gotten a little bit bread crazy here.  Started making sourdough back in November of last year and now I'm like on the process of getting my cottage bakery license. Yay.
17:06Providing, yeah, providing bread for, you know, neighbors and people in our community around us. That's simple  ingredients.  Yeah, I was actually pretty grossed out because I found a half loaf of bread at the bottom of my  bread thing. And it was from like January and there was not a speck of mold on it. I'm like, there's something wrong with that. Cause it's April now, four months later and it has not molded. It's so scary.
17:35That's not food. Versus I buy Renee's sourdough every week and by the next week, if it's not gone, which that's a rare occasion, but if it's not gone,  it's moldy  as it should be because it's a week old.  that tells you that  anything that has that super long shelf life, yeah, is terrifying. What's in it? Who knows what's in it?  Yeah. I don't  see, here's where it gets iffy for me.
18:02I don't want to scare people. want to empower people.  so maybe we just put the spin on this particular subject that if you make things from scratch, from whole ingredients,  number one, it's going to taste good, but you need to eat it. You need to eat it or freeze it. Yes.  Oh yeah. Yeah.  And it  is frightening how many young people are now getting sick when they should be in the prime of their lives and healthy.
18:32And I do think that it probably has something to do with the food.  But I also feel like young people these days aren't getting out in nature. They aren't moving their bodies. They aren't  grounding their bare feet in good black dirt. And I think that has to do with it too. Yeah. Our kids don't, for the most part, don't do electronics. They're outside. They're chasing the pony around. They're holding chicks. They're trying to catch the chickens, which
19:01It's pretty hilarious. We should be trying to catch the children.  So it's good times. should. But playing in dirt, you know, just take the sticks and hit the tree. That's what my son does. He runs around hitting things with a stick. That's fabulous.  He's learning cause and effect. And he's, like you said, staying grounded.  Yeah. I didn't realize that that was a thing until somebody I loved very much, like an auntie figure,  told me about it.
19:28She saw me take off my shoes in the grass one time, we're outside doing something. And I was just sitting there with my feet in the grass and she said, are you grounding?  And I said,  I don't know what that means.  And she said, oh, sweetheart, let me explain to you what you are doing right in this moment.  And explained to me the premise of grounding. And I did it all the time. Like my dad would go out until the garden in springtime  in this, you know, when it was warm.
19:57and the dirt was warm and I would go out and take off my shoes and stick my feet in the loam because it was warm and it felt good. And everybody thought I was kind of crazy because I did that and I was like, it feels good and it makes me calm down. I don't know why everybody's freaking out. So there are some real things to grounding yourself in the way that you need to. Yeah.
20:25I will say my feet are a permanent color of brown slash black all summer long. just like gets into the calluses.  And then it's just stuck like that all summer. I can't get it off as much as I scrub. I'll go and get my nails done, my toes done and fill.  They can't even get it out. We don't wear shoes.  Even as a kid, we were barefoot.  barefoot. Cole's grossed out that I would go into the horse pasture barefoot.  Oh, I say  out of the pasture.
20:55Yep.  I  think that dirty feet are the sign of a happy soul. Yeah. Yeah. They really do. Yeah. Yeah. And dirt under your nails. That's always a battle because I can't help but go out and dig in the dirt.  I walk by my garden, I got to go prune some stuff and check for progress. I do a walkabout every evening where I just go and I check my flowers and I see what's blooming and
21:24check my tomato progress, see if I can predict when I'm going to be able to pick that first tomato of the season,  check the chickens, get eggs,  do a head count on the animals.  It's just  such a peaceful time every evening and after, because I work full time. So after I get off work where I can go and just walk around the property and see the progress that's happening. And how satisfying is that?
21:50It's amazing.  Because I built it. I when I bought the property, so I've been living where I'm living right now for  oh my gosh, like 15 years.  So quite a while and it was nothing when I bought it. I mean, the house was run down. We've redone it a couple times since then and there were no gardens.  So we have a fairly established orchard with about eight apple trees. My husband made me raised beds that's full of lilies, dahlias.
22:20A bunch of annuals, I have my large  vegetable garden, the horses, the cows, the chickens. The majority of her yard is fenced in area.  it's all animal pasture. A lot of pasture. I utilize every inch of our property. If it's not grazing property, it's growing.  But we still have grass, grass for the kids.  Not much though.
22:48We have a large wildflower patch and so do you. both have wildflowers. Nice.  It's  just peaceful. Yeah, and beautiful.  I really feel like a lot of the people that I talk to on this podcast are very much drawn to beauty. And this lifestyle really, really, really hits that sweet spot. And no, it's not beautiful when you're watching your animals poop.
23:18or pee. It's what they do and it's not repulsive, but it's not beautiful.  But you look at them when they're just being themselves and being playful or just standing there looking gorgeous and you can't help but just appreciate the beauty of nature.  I just love to go out and sit and watch my little tiny dinosaurs run around and scratch  their
23:45Even chickens are beautiful. mean,  I'm not a chicken fan. don't, I've said this before, I don't like touching them because  the quills in their feathers just, I don't know, they set off an ick thing for me.  But  if I just brush my hand down their back, they're really soft.  And the new chickens, they're 26 weeks old now, something like that. So they're new chickens.
24:13their little fluffy butts are the best thing ever.  They look  so soft, like a kitten is soft. And I watch these chickens walk around and I will spend half an hour just watching the chickens do chicken things because I'm like,  what are they doing?  And then I figure it out and I'm like, oh, now I get it.  Yeah. Yeah. They're fun to observe. They're busy.  They're crazy.
24:40It's almost like a childlike joy though. mean, the kids will randomly run around, stop and look at things, play with things. It's that innocent  exploration that I think as humans were drawn to. Yeah. You might, you both might laugh at me, but I feel like homesteading, farming, gardening  is one of the  few lifestyles where you can take that moment and actually live in it.
25:09You know, be in it.  Oh, yes, for sure. Yeah, for sure. Because I can't tell you the last time I went for a drive  and I was in it, like experiencing the drive.  I don't experience the drive. going from point A to point B. when I look outside at my property and it's snowing and it's beautiful,  I stop and I actually  live in
25:38that moment, like I take a breath and I let it out and I experienced what I'm seeing. And there is something really important about that. Yeah, we are. For sure. For sure. And I'm gonna, I'm gonna say this, a friend of mine's husband passed away on Sunday and it was sudden and unexpected. And I am very sad for her. And it really reminded me that no one is promised tomorrow.
26:08So I might be riding this experiencing the moment a little hard because I'm feeling it right now. But you got to soak up all life has to offer because you don't know when it's going to be over. Right. 100%. Yeah. So it's just a little reminder that tomorrow isn't promised and today is a gift, which sounds really cliche, but it's also really true. It is so true. It is so true.
26:37Yeah.  So I don't know. Anyway,  it's been on my mind for today. Well, since yesterday, since last evening. So it's been a little sad, but it's okay. So what's I always ask people, what's the future look like for you guys? But it sounds like the future is that you are sisters who really love each other, which is amazing. And that you're going to keep growing this homesteading life together.
27:07Yes, for sure. Yeah. One of my biggest goals is to get an established greenhouse. So then I can have tomatoes earlier in the season and later in the season.  Tomatoes.  So we're going to have a green, she's going to have a greenhouse and I'm going to come over and bake my bread in her greenhouse to help heat it. And then we're going to sit under her banana tree and eat fresh baked sourdough bread in her warm greenhouse in the cold, cold.
27:36Minnesota winter. That's the plan. So I'm convinced,  well, my husband, the engineer is convinced that he can design, engineer a greenhouse that we can heat year round through mostly geothermal heat.  And  there's a bunch of tips to  utilize the,  gosh, I can't think of what it's called. Like the mass of water. So when you heat water with the sun during the day,  slowly releases that heat.
28:05through the evenings. So there's a guy in Canada that has bananas year-round. So that's my goal, is I want a banana tree and tomatoes and herbs year-round. I want to go out to my greenhouse and pick basil in January.  Me too. Me too. when you're done  with your answer to my question, I have a couple things about the greenhouse.
28:28Well, that's just the goal is the greenhouse more animals. I mean, that's kind of how the homestead page started. did. The greenhouse is expensive. if this homesteading page can take off and get more people interested, then that would help subsidize the costs of the greenhouse and possibly sponsorships and yeah, down the road. Steve calls, Jess calls me one morning and she's like, Hey, let's start a Facebook page so that I can.
28:56do my greenhouse down the road. just like that week, we're like, okay, here we go. Again, impulse. Impulse.  I tend to make decisions very fast.  But  also I follow through with them. I'm someone that once I decide to do something, I put everything that I have into it and  follow it all the way through.  That helps for sure.  Okay. So the geothermal thing for the greenhouse.
29:24It does work.  I applied for a grant a year and a half ago or so. And the point was to make a winter greenhouse.  did? Okay. And we got the grant, which is amazing to me. And last May, my husband and my son built the greenhouse. Like we ordered supplies, they built the greenhouse. It's amazing.  There are pictures on my Facebook page if you want to go look. You'll have to scroll back a little bit.
29:52I really wanted to do solar panels  and  a heater in the greenhouse that the solar panels would power. Yeah.  And my husband was like, no, I want to try this thing where you buy  the, of course, can't think of it, IBC totes, the plastic totes and fill them with water. Okay. Paint them black.  And then when the sun goes into the greenhouse, it will heat up the water because of the black paint on the outside.
30:20It will soak up  all that heat during the day and it will disperse it at night. There are like eight of these in the greenhouse, which takes up a lot of room.  It works. It did not work back during that really cold stretch in January, I think it was,  because it was cloudy. So  the water containers weren't soaking up enough heat to disperse it.  So  it gained us like...
30:50like October, November into December, it wasn't freezing in the greenhouse. But on the days when it's cloudy,  it doesn't work as well.  then there are, right now he's got tomato plants and pepper plants out there and he is supplementing the heat from the water containers with a space heater. And he's got the plants up high because heat rises.
31:17And the tomato plants and pepper plants are doing fine. And it's been like 47 to 50 degrees in there every night, every morning when it gets up. You're living my dream. That's what I want to do. Oh, that's so exciting that here in Minnesota, you've been able to do that. Yep. But I don't think I'm ever going to see a tomato in January out of that greenhouse because it just can't handle the extended days of cold. Yeah. We would put supplemental heat in there. So we'd be willing to
31:46to pay for a little bit of extra heat for those shorter months. Would you also use the groundwater too? Something about like the ground, is groundwater warmer?  The geothermal,  that's the underground.  I hear it works, but Minnesota is tough because you never know how cold it's actually going to get when it goes below zero in January and February. But I did hear the cloud is the problem, the cloud cover.  Minnesota has so many cloudy days.  Yeah.
32:16So yeah, it's  still a progress, but well, yeah, I think we'd put a wood stove in there where we just have my kids go throw some logs in.  Yeah, absolutely. And there are, there's a lot of ways you can do it, but he really wanted to try this IBC tote idea. And I was just like, it's your baby. Do what you want to do. Do the experiment. And I'd be like, that's great. As long as we have a backup heat. Yeah.
32:43Oh, well, my one my one foot putting down ish thing. Yeah, was that I didn't want the basil seedlings to go out until we know it's going to be over 40 degrees in there overnight. Yeah, those are my babies. I love basil and I didn't want them to die. So yeah, yeah. So you have a bunch of plants in your living room, don't you? On my table in my kitchen. Yes.
33:09Oh, it's in kitchen. I was close. I was close.  Right now, I think it's all basil. I think everything else went out to the greenhouse. How many basils do you plant?  A metric  ton this year. Oh my gosh, that's awesome.  But this is the first year that we're growing seedlings for the express purpose of selling them to people so that they can grow them in their gardens.  Gotcha. Cool.
33:33Because we don't have to sell people produce. I'm totally fine selling them the baby plants to grow their own. That's fine. Oh, yeah, 100%. And I'm excited about it because I want to get everybody growing a small backyard garden right now. Yes. Oh, yes, because you can control what's going in your food. 100%. Yes, and I'm very concerned about supply chain issues in the next year or so.
34:01I really want to encourage people that if they have any space to put in a raised bed to grow something, grow it,  do it. And it's a learning process. So, you know, start this year, get better next year and master the third year. And then you'll be able to supply your own food for your family. Or at least part of it, you know? And if you can't, if you don't have room to grow all of it, and we don't, we wouldn't grow everything for our house.
34:28You can go visit the people who growing the things you're not growing and you can trade or you can buy. Trade and barter.  100%. Yes,  exactly. know, make a little community of people in your neighborhood who grow things and trade things back and forth and you'll be better off. Isn't it funny? We're going back to the old days.  I sure hope so.  Exactly. Maybe I'll be ride my horse to work someday. You never know. think. I love to ride.
34:58I think you should just on principle do it once.  Well, I'd have to convince them to make a tie post for me,  like a hitching post.  Put my horse.  Yeah, that could be, oh my boss. Oh, that would be hilarious.  You don't have a bike rack at work? Oh, that's no fun.  No, I don't think they do. It's out in the country. So no, it's, we're, yeah, we're pretty, not really rural, but.
35:26There's not a whole lot around your clinic. All right. Well, ladies, it's been 35 minutes. I try to keep this to half an hour, so I'm going to cut you loose. I hope you have a wonderful rest of your day. Thank you for having us. Thank you for your time. Bye-bye.
 

Mary Loofah

Today I'm talking with Mary at Mary Loofah. You can follow on Facebook as well.
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00:00You're listening to A Tiny Homestead, the podcast comprised entirely of conversations with homesteaders, cottage food producers, and crafters, and topics adjacent. I'm your host, Mary Lewis.  A Tiny Homestead podcast is sponsored by Homegrown Collective, a free-to-use farm-to-table platform emphasizing local connections with ability to sell online, buy, sell, trade in local garden groups, and help us grow a new food system.  You can find them at homegrowncollective.org. If you're enjoying this podcast, please like, subscribe.
00:29Share it with a friend or leave a comment. Thank you.
00:57It's still pretty cold. think it's probably 35, 40 degrees right now. Oh, yuck. No, thanks. But it's spring. It's coming tomorrow. They're saying we're supposed to 81. I'm like great. Thunderstorms tomorrow night for sure. Yeah, it's been a wild spring. We've had such shifts in weather and temperatures. I'm like, mother nature, if you could just find a moderate place to be for a week, I would be so thankful. That would be great. So.
01:27Anyway, I covered the weather. I try to do this at beginning of every episode because why not? And everything we do is so dependent on the weather. I figure it's a good way to start. So tell me about yourself and what you do at Mary Luffa and explain why it's Mary Luffa because Luffa is not your last name. Well, I am Mary McDowell and I...
01:50milk goats. So I never in a million years thought that I would milk goats.  I am a horse trainer and equestrian by first trade. And  I got into goats when I had my first child. He was six months old and I was breastfeeding exclusively. And I just stopped producing milk overnight.  Oh  no.  given reason whatsoever.
02:19And I was in a panic, of course.  And so what happened was we tried the formula thing and it was projectile vomiting and projectile diarrhea out of my six month old who had yet to sleep through the night once. Oh God. So  tired mama,  very tired, hungry baby. And our neighbor across the street just happened to have  a Nubian milking goat.
02:43that they were using to feed other baby goats. And they said, well, you can use her to milk if you want to try the goats milk. So we did, we milked her. I had never milked a goat. I hadn't really even raised goats before, but I got on YouTube as everyone does and learned all the things I could learn as quickly as I could. And so we started milking her and God bless her. was this, gentlest goat in the whole world.
03:12And so the first time we gave our son goat's milk, he slept through the night  and started to gain weight and he was just thriving on it. And so  we kept milking her. Well, once we were done feeding him milk and he was ready to switch over to regular food, we had to give the goat back because she wasn't ours. She was just on loan.  And so she  ended up going home.
03:41And I was like, you know, I really miss this goat's milk. So we ended up being gifted another dairy goat  and  one goat turned into over 30 goats.  And my main mission is I want a homestead  and I want to help other people who need help. Like women trying to feed their children healthy is my bread and butter. That is like my passion. Of course, I will sell milk to anybody who wants the milk.
04:10But that is where my heart really is, is I want to help people who were struggling like I was struggling when I couldn't find something that would work and quickly, you know what I mean? yeah.  So the name Mary Lutha to go to the other half of that is of course we have the goats milk, but we also  have so much milk that there is an abundance. So we had to do something. So I started making soap and all the body butters and the lotions and
04:40all the things that you can make with goat's milk, cheese, yogurt, you name it.  Well, at the time I had started growing luffas and I'm sure you know, but for any listeners who don't know, luffas are basically in the gourd family and they look like giant cucumbers while they're growing and then they dry and you've got this amazing cleaning tool inside. so  my husband was offhandedly joking saying, you should just
05:09make a little store, you know, like an eight by eight building in the backyard and call it Mary Lufa. And I just kind of laughed it off. I was like, yeah, I'm, never going to be selling anything at that level.  Well, fast forward seven years and we have a huge shop that I have  a commercial refrigerator in for all the milk and all the other things. And I have my soap making area in there and I sell all sorts of stuff. We have an online store.
05:39It has just grown so exponentially from what I could have ever imagined.  And so it was just this little idea that my husband offhandedly mentioned and we just rolled with it. You know, it was, was, it was great. And it's been wonderful. How fabulous. What a great story.  first go, did she have a name? Yes.  Yes. Oh shoot. Of course I'm not going to remember it now.
06:08Um, what was her name? Her children were Opal and Diamond. Let me think about this. Do you remember her name, Trenton? It wasn't Ruby, was it? It was Ruby!  Okay. figured with Diamond and Opal, maybe it was a gemstone. It was. It was a gemstone. That's how they got the names. Yes.  Ruby. Thank I think that Ruby deserves an honorable mention for-
06:35Basically saving your baby's life. That's fantastic. Definitely. if you've listened to the podcast at all, I love goats. do. I love baby goats the most because they're the sweetest and easiest things ever to hold and pet and think that they love you. Yes. So yeah, I don't want to go too far down the goat rabbit hole here or the goat hole or whatever we're going to call it because
07:03talked a lot about goats on the podcast. Oh yeah. But for the record,  love them. Do not own any. Do not want to own any. I just want to visit the babies in the springtime. That's all I want out of goats.  And  we have friends who have goats and I'm going to message her later today.  I already messaged her once today about are there any baby goats coming  and if the mama barn cat's doing okay because we're going to get some kittens from her when they come.
07:31I meant to ask her if they were going to have any goat's milk once babies come, because  that's what happens. Because I do want to try making goat milk. So we've never done it. We've done just the water and lye, not  the goat milk and lye. Yes, yes. Well, need to text It's super, super similar. I would just recommend freezing it in ice cubes  because it heats up so fast you can scorch your milk  very quickly. But if it's frozen...
07:58it's much easier to just dissolve your lye that way and your milk will just thaw rapidly. then as it's heating up. Nice. Okay, cool.  All right. So I'm so jealous that you can grow luffa gourds in Oklahoma because we don't have a long enough growing season here to grow them. We now have a greenhouse. So I'm going to ask my husband if he will try planting some in the greenhouse.  Cause I think if we can get
08:28through October in the greenhouse with them, we might actually get some we can use. Yeah, yeah. And they're not easy to grow here. It's kind of hit or miss, but my mom has a greenhouse, so we start them as early as possible and just  hope and pray that they make it through long enough. Yeah, I really, I want to grow them because at the farmer's market, like three towns north of us or northeast of us,
08:56There's a woman that makes soaps and she actually pours the soaps around the loofah.  So it's basically a scrubby with soap wrapped around it.  And I love those things. I just want to be able to make some of my own.  So we're going to try it this summer. I've just got to remind my  husband to pick up some seeds  and we'll see how it goes. And obviously we won't have them this year. We won't have the scrubbies this year, but we should have some next summer. That would be awesome.
09:24If it works because you know, it's always it's always a crap shoot on new stuff. You never know what's gonna grow and what is it?  Okay, so I was I don't know I was looking through people I was supposed to talk with this week and I swear somebody had on their Facebook page these cookies that looked like the little Debbie oatmeal cookies Is that you or am I thinking somebody else? That's not me. I do not bake
09:51I don't know who it was. I'm so mad. I got to go find this person because evidently it wasn't somebody I was supposed to interview this week. So I got to go find the Facebook page and be like, um, come talk to me. And number two, can you ship from wherever you are? Yes. She does. I know it was a her and she does sourdough and she makes her cookies with sourdough. Um, cast off. it cast off? Whatever it's called. Discard. Yes. Not cast.
10:20Where the hell did that come from?  Um,  Diz card, yes. And she makes these, these beautiful looking oatmeal cookies with like, I'm guessing it's probably cream cheese frosting in the middle or buttercream or something. And I was just drooling over this picture. I'm like, I want that in my life right now.  So, okay. So you don't bake. Okay. That's cool. Do you, do you buy baked goods from people who do bake? Yes, I do. I actually  barter for milk.
10:49for a lot of baked goods. And my husband,  he is not a Suzy homemaker by any stretch of the imagination, but he has recently decided since he's seen enough reels of people baking easily that he's gonna put a hand at it. And  he's actually not too bad, but he's so impatient. I'm not sure how long it'll last. That is so funny because you and I share the same first name. my husband makes the most
11:19fabulous yeast breads you will ever taste. So that is really funny that your husband's like, I'm going to try baking. Huh, crazy. But you don't live in Minnesota, so we can't be like in-person best friends. I'm so sad. That would be so fun. Yeah, it's okay. I have, I have friends here that I actually see and then I have all the new friends I make when I talk to people on the podcast. It's really kind of great. Yeah, that's awesome.
11:49So you have kiddos, right? Yes.  How many? I have two. Girls? I have a boy that's seven and I have a girl that's four. Okay. And are they, do they love the goats too? They do. They love kidding season. They love playing with the goats. I think my daughter has definitely picked up the  animal husbandry gene and my son is definitely going towards the engineer side of things.
12:17He'll run the tractor and the excavator and all the other things. He likes the mechanical side of everything, but I don't think he wants to be a farmer, but that's all right. And yet they say that boys and girls are not different. Ha! Imagine that. Uh-huh. Yeah. I have four. My daughter is the oldest. She's 35. Three boys after her. Youngest boy is 23. Oh, man. And she...
12:45The oldest one, the girl, she was very into makeup and getting like secondhand clothes at thrift stores and then  tearing them apart and putting them back together the way she wanted them to be.  And she was very fashionable. Like she would put an outfit together that she tore apart and put back together and come downstairs from her room. And I would be like, you did that? Oh my God. How gorgeous is that?
13:13And the boys wanted to play with trucks and be outside in the dirt and help dad grow plants in the garden.  So  I  do think that boys and girls definitely are drawn to different things. I really do. And I don't think it's a bad thing at all. No, we need diversity.  % we need it.  Yup. that's all I got to say on that. I don't want to get my  listeners in a twist. That would not be good.
13:41So, time.  Let's just not make people mad right now. That would not be great.  Okay, so I looked at your Facebook page, not Facebook page, your website. your goats are gorgeous animals. My goodness. Thank you.  I was looking at the whole list of pictures that you have.  I was like, I want a goat dog because they just look like dogs to me for some reason.
14:11They act like dogs that just jump on the car instead of in the car.  Yeah, they're really pretty.  And I'm a sucker for a dog. Like, like I used to say I didn't want a dog. I just really loved other people's dogs. When I would go to visit them, they had a dog. The dog would realize I didn't really want a dog and it would come see me and hang out.  And then I got a dog. Now we have a dog and I love her to pieces. She's my fifth kid.  And so when I think about
14:41my friend that her parents raised goats when we were growing up. And the time I spent over at their place with the baby goats and the adult goats and just hanging out with her and the goats, it was like being around dogs, but they didn't bark. And I loved it. Yes. And my whole life, my whole life, I was like, I'm not in a position to get a dog as a pet. It's just not the time. And as soon as we decided to move to a place where we had land where that dog could be outside, we got a puppy.
15:11And I'm telling you, a puppy who turns into a really good, well-behaved dog is a little better than a goat sometimes.  They can at least tell you when strangers are there.  Oh, she's very, very good at that. She  has a very, I don't have the right word. She's an excellent watchdog is what she is.  What kind of dog is she?  She's an Australian Shepherd.  Oh, perfect. Yeah. So she
15:38It's so funny because we have friends that come  visit often enough that she recognizes their vehicles. Yes. And the minute she's always laying on the back of the couch, you know, looking out the window to make sure nothing's going on outside.  And the minute they turn into the driveway, she does this bay. She sounds like a beagle.  And then she barks. And I know that it's somebody that we know.  But if it's not somebody that we know, she does this really deep in her chest bark.
16:07And I'm like, oh no, who's here?  So, but  I keep telling my husband that we have enough room to get two goats  because we have 3.1 acres and we have, you got enough room for 10 goats. Yeah. The problem is he doesn't want to, he doesn't want to fence in the garden, the 100  by 150 foot garden. Yes. And if we got goats, he would have to fence in the garden.
16:36So right now it's a no, but I'm gonna try to drag him over to see the babies at my friend's house if they're coming this spring. I'm gonna try to get him hooked on what baby goats are like.  Be like, but they're pretty much the same the whole time they're alive. They don't really change from baby goats.  Well, at least when they're 160 pounds, they don't still jump on you like the babies do. That's helpful because those babies are crazy.
17:05They're so crazy.  I feel like I need a taser half the time. I'm like, y'all, settle down.  Yeah, um, puppies get zoomies. Goats get zoomies on steroids. Yes, yes, you're correct.  It's the cutest thing though. My goodness. Oh yes, they are adorable. It's sickening. It's sickening how cute they are.  Okay, so, so goats, luffas, luffagords.
17:34Do you actually grow a garden as well? Yeah, I do. I would not call myself a great gardener, but I sure give it a old school try.  We usually just plant things that we want to eat and sometimes  it's successful and sometimes it's not super successful.  We  mainly do like cucumbers and tomatoes.
18:00onions and potatoes, know, the staples for our household anyways. And I try to do  another technique every year to see what works  great. You know, I can pretty much throw tomatoes and cucumbers in the ground and have something grow and have a pretty decent season of it. But a lot of other things like I can't do bell peppers and we
18:25eat the heck out of bell peppers and the lettuce, it just turns bitter on me or bolts, you know? So it's a, I think it's a time management and pest management because we do everything organically that we can.  So  it's a struggle, but I still  try it and the kids love to pick the bugs off the plants every night. So that's helpful too.  That's really good that they want to help. That's awesome. The thing we discovered with bell peppers is that,
18:53The potato beetles that you can get, they like pepper plants too. Yeah. Yeah. I'm like, great. That's awesome. Yeah. They're everywhere. They're everywhere. Yeah. And we try really hard here with our garden to not use any pesticides.  But the second summer we were here when my husband was growing potatoes, came in and he was like, there's these little bugs all over the potato plants.
19:18And I said, did you take a picture? Because he knows if he takes a picture, I'm probably gonna be able to tell him what the thing is that he's asking about.  And he said, yeah. And I said, well, show me the picture and maybe I can tell you what the bug is. And he pulls out his phone and I look and I'm like, oh, those are potato beetles. And he's like, how do we get rid of them? I said, you're not gonna like the answer. He said, oh no. And I said, yeah. said,  I will call my dad and ask him.
19:45but I think he used to use sevens powder and it's not a great thing, but  it will take care of them right away.  And it basically washes off when it rains and then it's gone. It's not gonna hurt anybody to eat the potatoes. And he was like, okay. So I talked to my dad and my dad was like, that's what I used. And it took like  one application as soon as I saw the bugs and then they were gone. He said, it's not gonna hurt anything.
20:12like, okay, so told my husband he used sevens powder that one summer.  We haven't had potato bugs since. Wow. So we felt really bad about doing it because we really want to grow things as organically as we can. Yeah, sure. But when you're going to lose 25 potato plants.  Well, and you're going to lose them rapidly. Yeah. Yeah, it's they're extremely invasive.  Uh huh. They're awful. I hate those little bugs.
20:41Yeah. Okay. So cool that you're growing some stuff for your family to eat and for you to eat. That's great. So I want to talk about the benefits of goat's milk because I know it's really good for you to actually drink or have in cheese or ice cream or whatever. Yeah. But it's also really good for your skin. Thank you, Beakman Boys for teaching me that. Beakman 1802. I don't know if you know who I'm talking about.
21:08Oh, okay. Well, they're these famous guys, they're a couple and they were on the Amazing Race and they started a business basically on goat milk soap.  Oh, okay.  And it's become this big beauty  industry thing.  And  I don't know enough about them to keep talking about them. But anyway, that's how I learned about the fact that goat milk is really good for your skin. And there are reasons for that. Do you know the reasons for that? Well, you've got
21:38You've got all these probiotics, prebiotics, and even postbiotics  in your goat's milk, which is never going to hurt your skin.  depending on what your goats are consuming, you're also getting those nutrients  into your milk. So anything you add topically, not just drinking, is going to benefit the skin  significantly and the moisture content. It it shoots your homemade soap through the roof.
22:06If you can add the milk.  I would say as far as a drinking benefit, you've got all sorts of vitamins and minerals packed in there. And  I'm sure you know this, but the main difference between the goat's milk and the cow's milk  is the lactose levels. So there's only about 7 % less lactose in goat's milk, which doesn't sound like a whole lot, but it's obviously super significant since
22:36lactose intolerant people can generally tolerate goat's milk.  And I'm not sure if that,  scientifically, if that has anything to do with the skin side of things where it benefits that, but it is just an overall healthier  milk to drink. And I'm all for raw cow's milk as well.  But it's just a little bit easier on the stomach. And it is the third closest thing to human breast milk.
23:05second only to camel's milk and then of course the breast milk. So  it's just, it's packed with nutrients and it's easy, it's easily digested. And that's why you can feed goats milk to any species  as infants. like baby cows,  I've had people feed their baby squirrels, you name it. Obviously human babies can drink it, you know, and it is, it's a universal feeder.
23:35Yeah, and I don't know a lot of people raising camels for camel milk. So I'm quite sure the goat is a lot more handy to get to come by.  Absolutely. Absolutely. And the overhead for feeding the animal is  way lower.  We actually looked into camel farming at one point just as a,  know, just to  just to look around, know, and the price to start your camel farm was in the tens of thousands just to get the animal, you know, they're not
24:05common here in the States like they are  in the Middle East or even in Australia where they're actually a nuisance. Yeah. Yeah. So they're an invasive species  in some places. So yeah, it was  not something we could do, but it was fun to look at anyways. Yeah. Why not? I  mean, the more you know, the more you know, right? Yes, exactly.
24:30And  the other problem with camels that I have read about and heard about and I keep thinking that maybe I'm wrong is that camels tend to be a little more attitudinal than goats.  Oh very much so yeah they can be quite aggressive  and just finicky. Yeah the camel spitting is not a joke. Yeah  and they're so big. mean  you get an angry camel running at you, you want to get the hell out of the way real quick.  That's right.
25:00It's like, don't, it's like, um, there's a old joke about  being in a field with a bull and, and I don't know what the joke is now I think about it, but something about, only have to run faster than the person running behind me. Yes. Same thing with camels, I would guess. Yes. Okay.  Um, all right. What else do I got? I don't know why I'm being so silly. It's afternoon. That's probably why.  Um,
25:28I don't know what else to ask you. What's the future look like for you guys? I don't know what the future holds, to be honest. I mean, we want to definitely keep on the trajectory of getting as much milk out as possible.  And I would love to  grow my soap side of things.  I pretty much stay sold out of milk week to week. There's usually a waiting list, but I can always
25:54you know, squeeze in, I just need a gallon here or there and whatnot.  But I'd love to just keep growing the soap side and body care side of things  of the business. And we're just on  4.9 acres  that we live on. And my parents,  we're in Oklahoma, but my parents are from Dallas  and
26:21They just moved up here a few years ago and they bought 80 acres across the street. they  live there and that's where we keep like our male goats  so that the milk doesn't start to smell like bucks  in fall. I can just kind of rotate and I can rotate the does over there when they're done milking and they have a chance to just kind of rest and the pastures here can rest and.
26:49things like that and it's just a new set of scenery. I think it's good for everybody mentally after a long season of milking. Yeah, that's phenomenal that your parents moved in right across the street. That's great. Yeah, it was a God thing for sure.  absolutely.  So when you make your goat milk soap, do you use like essential oils or what?
27:13Yeah, so I use essential oils and I do use manufactured  fragrances  from big name suppliers  for soap making  and then I of course have a line of unscented for sure and I do  a line of natural colored soaps and some that have like the manufactured micas and pigments and things like that.
27:38But I try and be a little bit diverse with as much of it as I can. If you want to be hyper crunchy, I've got a bar for you. If you're not on the crunchy train as much, I've got a bar for you too. Nice. It's so much fun to have that freedom to experiment with all of it. Yes, absolutely. We screwed up. I can't remember if it was last summer or the summer before, but we got some pumpkin spice scented fragrance oil.
28:07for soaps.  And I swear to you, the two kinds we got, I read  the stuff, the information before we ordered it. And I swear I thought that it was skin safe.  Not so much. So we have, I literally am sitting in my bedroom where my desk is and we have a soap drying rack up on  the bump out.  And it's got one batch of one kind and one batch of the other, the pumpkin spice scented stuff.
28:37And they have sat there since we made them because we don't know what to do with them. They smell good, but  the only thing you really use them for is hand washing.  I wouldn't recommend you use it on your body skin, you know?  right.  So that was a mistake. Luckily, we only made one batch of each  and the bottles have sat in the cupboard since we bought it. But  you ought to make pumpkin spice candles.  Oh, we do. Oh, good. OK.
29:06We do. We're going to make some of those again this summer for  this fall. Yes.  and stuff. But I was so bummed. was like,  um, those aren't skin safe. After my husband had made the soap and it was, it was sitting doing this upon a vacation process.  And he said, excuse me. And I said, look, it says it on the bottle. And he's like, how did you miss that? I said, I have no idea.  He says, well, he says, can we use it for candles or?
29:35wax melts and I was like, yes. He said, okay, good. said, cause that was like, that's, that could have been an expensive mistake. I wonder if you like  graded the soap down into a wax melt, if it would still put off the scent. Oh, I'm sure it would. But you probably do that. You got nothing to lose.  No, no, they're just sitting here looking like.
30:01you know, regular old soap bars and I'm like, we can't do anything with those.  So gotta figure it out. But yeah, I'm sure.  I actually, I'm quite sure that if we just cut it into little blocks and put it in a wax melter, it would probably do the same thing. Yeah, probably over time for sure. And it would be the cleanest wax melting container ever. That's right.  So yeah, but that's
30:25That's part of joy of this lifestyle. You try things and sometimes it goes really well. And other times you make a mistake and you're like, what, how can I make that no longer a mistake? How can I turn it into something else? Yes, exactly. That is the beauty of it.  And, things, but just the amount of things you learn that you can use  off the homestead too. I mean, we, we have learned how to use so many different tools in this lifestyle and our, just our arsenal.
30:55and tool bags  of,  I can fix this. Oh, I can cook that. I can make this. You know,  it's, just pretty incredible. This lifestyle is just so eye-opening and it just makes real like, it's like a modern day pioneer. You have to make things work when they don't seem like they can work. Well, I'm gonna, I'm gonna  quibble a titch. If you're lucky, you don't have to make it work, but you want to make it work. Yeah.
31:26Absolutely. Cause if you have to, that has a whole different feel than want to. Yes. Yes, for sure. For sure. It's like we bought a, um, a riding lawnmower that could be used as a tractor  used  and,  it worked for a little while and then stuff went wrong with it. And  my husband was like, okay, here's the two choices. And I said, all right, I'm ready. He said,  I can keep working on this tractor to try to make it work.
31:55and it's really too small for what we need it for. He said, or he said, we can leave it and I can tinker with it in my spare time. He said, and we can actually buy a Kubota tractor that we can use to plow the driveway and to  turn the compost pile and blah, blah. And I was like, let's just get the Kubota tractor and you can tinker with the old fashioned little lawnmower tractor when you're ready. He's like, okay, yeah, that's probably smart.  So.
32:22There are choices to be made here and sometimes the old fashioned stuff is fantastic.  Other times you need the thing to work now. Exactly. Yes. And that's the nice thing about being in the  21st century is we have that luxury in most of the areas that we live in. And so it can it can be at well let's  put this one to the back burner and go to something that's going to get it done. Yeah. And sometimes that's got to happen.
32:51If it isn't a gotta happen now thing, you can screw around with stuff and be creative and ingenious and it works sometimes.  So, all right, Mary, it's been over half an hour. It's been a joy to chat with you. I had a really good time. Thank you for your time and I hope you have a wonderful weekend because tomorrow is Friday. It might as well be the weekend.  Absolutely. Thank you so much, Mary, for having me on and I hope to chat with you again sometime.